2011 Muppet Movie plot officially announced

Drtooth

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I don't think that the comics would have lasted around forever, but gee golly, they shoulda lasted right up until the movie. I kinda agree that 2 comics starring a license coming out in a month was going to lead to burn out in the long run, but even then, just get rid of one of them. The Muppet Show Comic Book was clearly going to end somehow with Roger gone (and believe me, I intend on getting Snarked!)... but continuing either the classics line or coming up with something else new and exciting just up until the movie to keep the momentum slowly going would have been nothing but helpful. I still kinda wanted to see a 4 part Muppets Tonight comic miniseries... If I was established as a cartoonist, I would have indeed pushed for one.

But internal politics got in the way, Pixar titles disappeared dragging the Muppets down with them, all got consolidated to Marvel, and nothing's coming out of Marvel but reprint magazines. But I don't think we would have got Darkwing Duck and Ducktales out of it if those were still going.
 

RedPiggy

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scottishpiggy said:
yeah bit of a plot point there - in the TV christmas movie Pepe lists it as a historical landmark so the bank cant take it away from them.
Key words: "the bank". The oil company is not a bank. Loophole! :big_grin:
outerelf said:
I believe it was stated in some interview that it takes place as if the Muppet Theater/the Muppets themselves haven't been around since Jim Henson died.
Like after the special where they mourn him?
Drtooth said:
And MFS and revelations that Gonzo was an alien have been disavowed.
It COULD be tied to Muppet Babies, since, really, they implied it first.
beaker said:
Gonzo is not an alien.
Never really understood what irks people about that. I guess I'm just used to accepting the little whatever for what he is, so specifying it doesn't really change things for me.
Kermit and Piggy are not married.
GASP ... LIAR!

LOL ... :big_grin:
 

Frogpuppeteer

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Never really understood what irks people about that. I guess I'm just used to accepting the little whatever for what he is, so specifying it doesn't really change things for me.
i feel the same way, i mean one of the reasons MFS is my least favorite is it was Missing the Musical Numbers
 

Beauregard

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The Muppet Show Comic Book was clearly going to end somehow with Roger gone (and believe me, I intend on getting Snarked!)
I felt a bit snarked myself when I heard they were ending the run!
 

beaker

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I'm not being a pessimist so much as more of a CNN talking head pundit giving political analysis from a contextual basis. Trend analysis, realism, statistics, etc. Sometimes I'm right, a lot of times I'm wrong, other times it's a mixed bag.

People were dissing on Langridge's "odd style" adapting the Muppets at first before the comic series started, and I said it was a welcome new take and that his series was going to be the biggest shot in the arm since Palisades.However, I also around the time made the unfortunate comment that I originally didn't know if the team behind Sarah Marshall was right for a new Muppet film. Yet, it was precisely Segal's rabid obsession of using all his clout to convince Disney to make a new Muppet film; which many people never thought would happen(at least, not in the big way of 50 million dollar tentpole treatment) I also naively would for awhile say "next year will be the Muppet's glorious return or renaissance" on here. So far there's nary been a peep about this film exactly four months to go. But I agree, it's possible they are just choosing to get the media blitz cranking 2-3 months prior.

Disney can pull an "Emperors New Groove" or "Up" and release little to no merchandise. It's possible. Certainly we can't expect anything even remotely comparative to the merch/marketing juggernaut that was Toy Story 3. That was Phantom Menace level of insane penetration in the collective consciousness. I saw at least 7 random people today at the state fair with Muppet related shirts. Not Sesame, but Muppet characters. So they are still in the collective consciousness, maybe not to the saturation of other beloved franchises...but it's there. Disney would be reviled and stupid for not putting big muscle behind merchandise. I personally don't like how the only place to buy Muppet related merch is at the bottom of the barrel hedonism emporium that is "Spencer's Gifts".

To Dr Tooth: Where are tv shows(non HBO/Showtime/premium) looking more like movies? Yes, they have bigger budgets, explosions, epic storylines. But look wise? Still looks like tv. Meanwhile in 1999 Sopranos came out looking like a theatrical film. I see promos for virtually every NBC/CBS/ABC/TNT/AMC original and I haven't seen theatrical looking stuff. It's all on HBO and Showtime...which is funny, as for $700 you can buy a Nikon 3100 DSLR camera and do high end film looking dv without even too much post conversion. Frogboy is right, maybe they'll make it look more "filmish" in post conversion. MFS at least looked theatrical, and had an amazing 20 minutes.

If we're going to be completely candid and honest, I'm a bit worried about the film and the muscle behind it. Segal can do all he can do and then some, but that doesn't guarantee an overall slam dunk execution or solid marketing/merch/awareness campaign.

My worry is this:

- The film may feel disjointed, too schticky and tv modern. uneven and feel more like a modern TV 90 minute special than a proper theatrical film. I worry we'll have awe striking moments that pop and leave us teary eyed(beholding the mighty rebuilt theater, Kermit's speeches, etc) BUT that the film will be heavily saturated and peppered with things that greatly take away from the overall experience(be they bad gags, cringe worthy dialogue or setups, etc) I just worry of a letdown/disappointment. I'll take anything from visionary(the first time you saw The Matrix, Dark Knight, etc), to "pretty good", to good.

- Very little (quality) merchandise. I'm not saying we need Cars 1 or Toy Story 3 level of almost nauseating over saturation. But it wouldn't be right for Disney to make this it's main holiday film only to skimp or forgo the expected Disney merchandise factor.

- Marketing/awareness/creative ways of promotion worries. Some speculate Disney is waiting for 2-3 months in to let the hammer drop and the blitz to begin. No problem.
But they need a comprehensive obligatory tv interview/junket, online scroll over blitz, endless online coverage, a really cool movie specific site, but then what I call the x factors: guerrilla and inventive viral marketing, show stopping appearances(MTV movie awards? SNL again? crazy viral youtube videos? Hiring Bansky to do street promotion?) Disney needs to send a clear message...the Muppets are back and as inventive as ever

If this film underwhelms, it could have some serious complications and mean a lot of setbacks. Pooh's fate never hinged on the new film. Disney knew only certain people would go see it anyways, so they never even bothered promoting it too much.
Either way, it'll be very curious to see the demographic makeup of who will go see this and be interested in the muppets come this fall.
 

Drtooth

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It COULD be tied to Muppet Babies, since, really, they implied it first.
You might as well tie in the terrible Chaos at the Carnival game as well, it implied Space Gonzos too... even further back, the Atari Pigs in Space game.

As for them disavowing Gonzo being an alien... I'm not talking fanbase... Dave Goelz even said that (through Gonzo) it was just a movie. When the character itself denies it, it's usually a sign.

Kermit and Piggy aren't really married due to the fact it's an easy way to keep the old gag of their relationship. Sometimes I wish they WERE married because those jokes ARE old!

Disney can pull an "Emperors New Groove" or "Up" and release little to no merchandise. It's possible. Certainly we can't expect anything even remotely comparative to the merch/marketing juggernaut that was Toy Story 3. That was Phantom Menace level of insane penetration in the collective consciousness. I saw at least 7 random people today at the state fair with Muppet related shirts. Not Sesame, but Muppet characters. So they are still in the collective consciousness, maybe not to the saturation of other beloved franchises...but it's there. Disney would be reviled and stupid for not putting big muscle behind merchandise. I personally don't like how the only place to buy Muppet related merch is at the bottom of the barrel hedonism emporium that is "Spencer's Gifts".
Merchandise is going to be tricky, to say the least. No one really buys anything anymore. not even that people don't have money and the price of everything is going up... people just don't buy toys the way they used to. I'm expecting at least a line of plush and some other goods like that. Maybe a PVC line if we're REALLY lucky. I don't see anything half as big as Toy Story, EVEN THOUGH the characters exist outside of a series of films.

Now, ENG, they just completely threw to the wind, they treated it like crap, and the ONLY merchandise I saw was a kid's meal, soundtrack and coloring books. A year later, a bean bag line with 4 characters. So far, we've gotten word of Muppet Nail Polish, a series of books, a cover CD, a soundtrack CD, and Pez. Already that eclipsed what ENG had at first. Seriously... not even 10th anniversary plush. Up was a bi-product of Ratatouille merchandise not doing well... I mean, it's a movie about gourmet rats and had a lot of foodie inside jokes... not something kids want to play with. And we all have to relent... what kid wants to play with an old man toy? Up had some stuff, but it was (i guess this was a wise tie in in retrospect) travel gear and little explorers stuff. I have to say, it wasn't all that smart to make huge giant plush of the other dogs besides Dug. And it took them forever to release Kevin, and those went very fast.

Still, I didn't get the Dug bean bag yet. Luckily that's still there.

Muppets IS different... not only should it go beyond the movie, the characters are all lovable enough for kids to want toys of any and every character. I can't envision a little kid cuddling a plush Carl Frederickson, but I CAN see a kid cuddling a Big Mean Carl. I just hope that we get a LOT of bean bag plush out of this movie. And not just the Gonzo, Piggy, Animal stuff... At the very least make a Scooter.
 

CensoredAlso

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Kermit and Piggy aren't really married due to the fact it's an easy way to keep the old gag of their relationship. Sometimes I wish they WERE married because those jokes ARE old!
Oh heck, as far as I'm concerned they got married back in 1984! Anything else I don't even hear, lol.
 

Beauregard

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Oh heck, as far as I'm concerned they got married back in 1984! Anything else I don't even hear, lol.
Interesting, considering that even Jim backtracked on that one...And if they are gunna be apart, I'd rather believe they never married than that they got divorced or separated. Don't get me wrong, I too wish that they were married because frankly the other stuff is getting boring, BUT I just don't see how people can take that part of the movie as real and in the same breath claim that Gonzo isn't an alien or that Scooter wasn't the EM's road manger. Nothing in the movies can be said to be real or not real except out of character moment...(Kermit and Piggy fighting by the duck pond) or interviews (which are the 'real life' Muppets) but even then they'll just do something to be funny.

How many times does it have to be denied by BOTH parties (even Piggy doesn't pull the married line anymore) before people accept it?

Although...every one is entitled to their own opinion, obviously. What happens off-screen is up to our own imaginations!
 

CensoredAlso

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How many times does it have to be denied by BOTH parties (even Piggy doesn't pull the married line anymore) before people accept it?
I told you, I don't even hear it. :wink:

I did hear Piggy call Kermit "hubbie" at the 30th anniversary special though, hehe.
 

RedPiggy

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Drtooth said:
As for them disavowing Gonzo being an alien... I'm not talking fanbase... Dave Goelz even said that (through Gonzo) it was just a movie. When the character itself denies it, it's usually a sign.
You'd deny what you are too if you realized nearly everyone despised the claim.
 
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