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Am I the only one who HATES what they have done to Fozzie's puppet?

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by toadster101, Nov 9, 2015.

  1. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    I love seeing early AM inserts: some of those Season 1 inserts, with the out-of-focus eyes that make them look dead were pretty bad, yes, but from Season 2 and throughout the 70s, they're great. There was a particular lavendar AM in the early 70s that had highly visible seams (think Howie the bunny that Cookie Monster ate, or the alphabet alien): I love those inserts where the AMs are semi-blank like that, it brings to mind Kermit Love's mindset that less is more (and I agree), those inserts really put that into perspective.
    For sure, anytime a puppet is too stiff, too heavy, too cumbersome, that's going to affect the overall performance: it's like how the first Gary Gnu puppet on THE GREAT SPACE COASTER had too small a mouth and wasn't very expressive.
  2. Pig's Laundry

    Pig's Laundry Well-Known Member

    Yeah the designs really don't bother me in the slightest. While Gonzo and Fozzie's newer designs took awhile to get used to I'm really okay with them now. The rest of the redesigns like The Newsman,Kermit,Miss Piggy,Crazy Harry,Lew Zealand,and the Electric Mayhem etc are totally spot on.
    Duke Remington and Muppy like this.
  3. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    I actually felt Crazy Harry perhaps suffered the most from having that "too perfect/too pristine" look, but that could be just me.
    Reevz1977 likes this.
  4. Pig's Laundry

    Pig's Laundry Well-Known Member

    Well actually you may be right,his skin is a bit too smooth and his head is too tall.
  5. Mo Frackle

    Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    Post-2008 Gonzo has never sat well with me for the reasons mentioned by others - too stiff and probably uncomfortable for Dave to perform. I'm no expert, but even I can tell when something is off about a puppet.
    Drtooth likes this.
  6. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    The eyes are also a bit too small. If they were the slightest bit bigger, they'd be a bit more expressive. He kinda looks either dead-eyed or deadpan, whichever fits the case. And his nose is a little too perfect. I want to say it looks a little thick too but A) there's no way to say that without it coming out wrong and B) maybe it's in the eyes. You know, drawing Gonzo I could never get that nose shape right.

    As for the new Fozzie design, I've checked out the Time line on Muppet Wiki. I'd say the best looking one was near the turn of the 90's. Seems that they've been completely inconsistent with the jaw line for years after that, and I never really liked the rounded jaw look they used. Funny thing is, the Fozzie poser at the end of the list looks better than the actual puppet they're using now, at least as far as head shape is concerned.
    Mo Frackle likes this.
  7. Mo Frackle

    Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    Interesting. Would that explain why we see less of Rowlf, as well? Or does he have different fur?
  8. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    It even seems like all of the post-2002 Elmos we've had have also had a really combed-down look to him; I personally prefer the Elmo of 1998-2002, when they gave him smaller eyes and a rounder head, but still had just a slight shagginess to his fur.
    I think the main reason we see less of Rowlf is because he's just now starting to be utilized a little more since being retired all of those years out of respect to Jim.
    Mo Frackle likes this.
  9. 123Sunny

    123Sunny Well-Known Member

    I wouldn't say I HATE it, but I definitely prefer the old one, he's just so much cuter! I love Fozzie though, and maybe between seasons they will update it. I'm sure they know that fans don't like this and work on a change. The mouth on the old one just looks better, in my opinion :o
    Duke Remington likes this.
  10. muppetlover123

    muppetlover123 Well-Known Member

    Fozzie does look to new, but after a while you just get used to it
    123Sunny and Duke Remington like this.
  11. cahuenga

    cahuenga Well-Known Member

    Of the last 20 years, my favourite Fozzie its the one used on the Letters to santa special...and my favourite puppet since the character debuted its the one from the season 2 of TMS, from Milton Berle episode for example...
  12. Convincing John

    Convincing John Well-Known Member

    There could be some difference in how they store and preserve the puppets that affect how they look on camera. I was on the Sesame Street set in 2010 when they filmed "The Very End of X" episode. It makes a difference, I think, depending on what character they are getting ready to film.

    Abby wasn't in that episode, but I did see her on one of those poles near, but not touching any other puppets on sort of a hatrack-type thing. My guess is that they had to keep her pristine because of her pigtails and the sparkly...um...(glitter?) in the ostrich feathers. (It's hard to see what exactly was in there. Even in HD, the camera can't pick up what you see in real life).

    They had a Fat Blue (as a cowboy) on the table, but sitting upright and on one of those poles. Again, he was a little ways away from the other characters, but the Sesame Workshop folks didn't seem to mind his pants touching the table.

    There was an ox, which was furry, but they had just, well, tossed him on the table. It didn't seem to matter that his fur got a little matted (or ruffled up) for the shoot.

    We all know how Snuffy is stored. Still, they were careful on the set to brush him by hand when Marty and Bryant Young walked him to the arbor. The puppet wranglers looked like they were petting him, actually. It's reddish-brown ostrich feather strands, so they did kind of float a little. (One fell on Leela's face just before they shot her scene).

    Big Bird, as we know, was handled by white-gloved folks and Caroll together when he got into the bird. The wranglers had to "pet" him, too.

    As for Oscar, well, I saw Caroll perform Oscar on the set, even though he wasn't in that episode. (He entertained a few fans). He might look clean on the screen, but I know exactly how Caroll stores him. Caroll takes Oscar off, rolls and wads him up and throws him in a puppet cabinet in the corner. Yeah, just like how a kid would treat an itchy sweater they got from their Aunt Gertrude.

    I'll have to find it, but there's something Kevin Clash said about how the "used look" of the characters (like having a baseball glove that fits) looks good on camera.

    So, maybe the pristine look might have to do with character or whatever materials they're made out of. I agree they need to improve Fozzie's look, though. Why doesn't Puppet Heap hire Terry Angus, for crying out loud?
    Duke Remington and Pig's Laundry like this.
  13. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    I have to do that "petting" too - it helps straighten up the fur and keeps it from looking mussed and ruffled.
  14. 123Sunny

    123Sunny Well-Known Member

    Agreed. What's most important is he keeps his loveable Fozzie personality!
    Duke Remington likes this.
  15. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

  16. Mo Frackle

    Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    I also find some of the newer puppets (Denise, Debbie) a bit too stiff.
  17. Pig's Laundry

    Pig's Laundry Well-Known Member

    Hey, great article Joseph(which I now know is your name) I had no idea you blogged! I see you wear glasses, for some reason I always pictured you having glasses.
  18. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    Yep. I've been around for a while, lol.
    I used to have that ability too, to somehow accurately picture the way people actually look, and much of the time I would be right.
    Pig's Laundry likes this.
  19. Duke Remington

    Duke Remington Well-Known Member

    Such a complaint is still stupid and petty. Such advances in puppet-building do not take away warmth or edge at all.

    At the end of the day, what really matters is the personalities of the characters and how they're written. And as long as the characters retain their personalities, puppet looks should not matter.
    123Sunny likes this.
  20. Reevz1977

    Reevz1977 Well-Known Member

    Duke Remington - you do know what an opinion is...right??!!

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