1. Welcome to the Muppet Central Forum!
    You are viewing our forum as a guest. Join our free community to post topics and start private conversations. Please contact us if you need help with registration or your account login.

  2. Sesame Street Season 45
    Sesame Street's 45th season officially begins Monday September 15. After you see the new episodes, post here and let us know your thoughts.

  3. "Muppets Most Wanted" Fan Reactions
    After you see "Muppets Most Wanted", read fan reactions and let us know your thoughts on the Muppets eighth theatrical film.

Frank Oz worked on a new Muppet movie script

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by cahuenga, Nov 21, 2011.

  1. beaker

    beaker Well-Known Member

    I agree it was the film that had to be made...I mean it feels special in parts, but other times it feels way off for me(Gonzo in particular) Im really hoping the next film they make can be a ittle more down to earth, more natural styled filmmaking like an indie film/december period clooney drama or the original movies. I feel muppets work best in that environment..just check out the 2003 Mastercard commercials. I want to see the Muppets walking around real downtown areas like in the Muppets take manhattan...not closed sets all the time.

    Btw is there any word on when we'll know if there will be extras in the march release? I am so curious what got cut.
  2. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I just checked out the Winnie the Pooh movie. The standard DVD came with 3 deleted scenes, the Blu-Ray came with 5 more. So I'm sure most of the deleted scenes are going to be on the special super duper BluRay edition.

    Still, I hope they have very important key deleted scenes. I wasn't exactly wowed by any of the ones from the VMX DVD, and there was entire cameos that didn't even see a DVD special feature of the Simpsons release. I hope that Jason et all pulled for everything possible to be on these releases.
  3. blackaerin

    blackaerin Active Member

    I think there was an overall problem with communicating with the audience on what's going on. Important plot points and character were not given enough focus on and menial gags getting too much focus.
    Tex Richman's backstory, why the Muppets disbanded in the first place, what was up with the Piggy Kermit drama. There were moments, but nothing that we can sink our teeth into and enrich the story, and no one else referred to them until they became important.

    It ended up being quite distracting actually, wondering about these plot points during the movie, hoping they'd be answered and even more confused when it ended unanswered.

    Hate to sound like a broken record, but they really could've built up Walter's shining moment a lot better. I wasn't even aware he could whistle at all. From what I can remember, the only time he ever whistled besides the number was during the cleaning montage, and even then it was so subtle you don't even realize it as anything special.

    Personally, I think they tried too hard to be funny/cool/hip. I was getting Oz flashbacks, especially during the Richman Rap.
  4. Duke Remington

    Duke Remington Active Member

    Sorry, but I never saw anything of the sort in this movie.
  5. Scooterforever

    Scooterforever Active Member

    I think getting rid of Gary & Mary would have created ample time for all of these things to be explained. I feel Walter was essential in serving as a catalyst for getting the Muppets back together, but scrapping the whole Gary/ Mary/ Smalltown subplot would have allowed for a lot more to be explained in the 1 and 1/2 hours the movie was given. Segel writing himself into the film as Gary was just self-serving, pure and simple, in my opinion, and I think having a guy previously known for nothing other than Judd Apatow films may have hurt the film's marketability. On the other hand, I feel like no matter what the studios would've wanted a marketable A-list star to play a major role, and Amy Adams, a great and diverse actress, fills that niche nicely. I loved the film overall and I've seen it 6 times in theaters thus far, but the Gary & Mary subplot seemed to stop the film dead at times.
  6. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    There was a lot of focus on the human characters, but no where near classic retelling levels. I don't mind the Gary/Mary subplot at all, but only because it's a subplot. It gives some sort of tension to the Gary/Walter subplot. I tried thinking of what would happen if Mary wasn't in the film, they probably could have done it without her, but then there wouldn't be tension to the human catalysts. The plot was mainly about saving the Muppets, bringing them back together, and I don't think it would have worked out the same if it was just Kermit slamming his fist down and saying, "I'm getting everyone back together."

    We WERE going to have to have some celebrity being a large focus. That's what the Classic Retellings were. If we got one of those, we'd relaunch the franchise to classic retellings, each getting less interesting than the next. This was the film that had to be made, this was the story that was meant to be told, this is the film that will relaunch of franchise of endless possibilities.

    If there's anything outside of the Muppet franchise I think this could be compared to, it's probably Looney Tunes Back in Action. That was supposed to relaunch the Looney Tunes, and it completely failed. The humans were much more the focus and much more 1 dimensional, said humans were completely worthless and useless to the movie, there were more throwaway gags than plot, and of course there were huge behind the scenes conflicts with studio meddling rewriting the movie to make it less comprehensible. We could have got something THAT messed up that would have sunk to the bottom of the Box Office as soon as it came out. And we ALL know what happened to the Looney Tunes after that movie failed.

    Everyone's problem seems to be about the same thing... editing. I don't know if the filmmakers even got the choice to make those cuts. A few more scenes would have made the difference, I agree. But what's there was enjoyable, most people loved it, and we're going to get more stuff out of it as a result. What's wrong with that?
    Mupp and Duke Remington like this.
  7. Scooterforever

    Scooterforever Active Member

    Yes, I enjoyed the movie overall. Great comparison w/ LT: Back in Action. I agree, The Muppets could've been that, but it wasn't. My gosh, just thinking about Loonatics hurts my soul:sigh:. I still loves me some classic Daffy Duck cartoons, and his dueling pianos scene in Who Framed Roger Rabbit was epic.
    Mupp and Duke Remington like this.
  8. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member


    The Muppets is LUCKY, Dang lucky, it didn't have the behind the scenes dilemmas and drama that Looney Tunes BIA had. LTBIA was almost an entirely different movie. Even opened up with a sharp, stinging satire of WB's problems getting another Batman movie off the ground (something they did for years after Batman and Robin killed the franchise). The entire end of the movie was rewritten and refilmed, and they didn't even show the full alternate version on the DVD. And a lot of it was filled with too many old Looney Tunes gags that fell flat. I still don't get the bit about the giant robotic Charlie the Dog. That was completely useless. And I have to say, Gary and Mary were likable as the humans... Jenna Elfman was cold and nasty, Brendan Frasier came off too much a loser to find sympathetic. They could really have just done the movie with Bugs and Daffy, but apparently the star power of 70 year old cartoon characters wasn't good enough and they needed B listers to round out the cast. Steve Martin, on the other hand, hasn't been that wacky and fun since he was singing about King Tut on SNL! His artistic stuff is great... I'm a huge Steve Martin fan... but I do love those classics.

    Even then, I still quite enjoyed it. it could have been better, much better... there's no call for it to have done so poorly. Elf, maybe... but the Cat in the Hat? That was an offensive piece of crap.

    And because WB felt that the entire fate of the Looney Tunes fell on one movie (that they ruined with constant meddling), they dumped all these plans to make new classic style shorts (including a series of Daffy shorts where he was back to his Bob Clampett wackiness)... they felt they needed to hip it up, they came up with the failure Loonatics, and it took years for them to recover. The Muppets seems to have done well enough, it will hit big on DVD, and we'll see something else soon enough, even if it's just a TV special.
    Mupp and Duke Remington like this.
  9. Scooterforever

    Scooterforever Active Member

    Ach, there hasn't been a good Muppets TV special (at least in my opinion) since Muppets Go to Disneyworld. Their music videos and web spots have been quite good, however, so there's always that avenue.
    heralde likes this.
  10. Yorick

    Yorick Active Member

    I thought you were a fan of the Filmation cartoon...I know I am, and it's not a bad thing at all that they travel through time and space! :)
  11. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Oh, I am... I just find it really funny that the Filmation cartoon had the original premise of the Ghostbuster movie, back when it was supposed to be a Dan Akroyd and John Belushi vehicle. Back before Harold Ramis was involved.
  12. Yorick

    Yorick Active Member

    Sorry, I guess the "worst thing" part of the quote confused me, but you're right, it's quite an interesting coincidence! :)
  13. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I should have said weirdest thing... but "worst" as in it adds to the confusion. It's just like the WEIRDEST co-incidence... unless that's what the original idea Columbia proposed before they went to DIC... but I don't think they said anything about that.

    Then of course there's the Dennis the Menace fiasco. 2 different characters in 2 different countries come up with the same character name at roughly the same time...weird.
    Yorick likes this.
  14. Filmation's "Ghostbusters" was based on a 1970s Saturday morning live action show with Larry Storch, Forrest Tucker, and a guy in a gorilla suit (called "The Ghostbusters"). However, the cartoon series was put in production AFTER the success of the Ghostbusters movie. No relation to any of Dan Ackroyd's concepts at all.
  15. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Not quite.

    Legal matters arose due to the name when the film went into production (once again, both projects were named after, and an homage to an old comedy called "Spook Busters" ). Columbia had to pay Filmation a licensing fee for the name of the movie. Filmation even tried to get Columbia to collaborate with them for an animated series, but then Columbia went another way (DIC). Lou even regretted not asking for animation rights in the settlement. So they made a cartoon based on their version of Ghost Busters while Columbia did there... hence why Columbia's version was "The Real Ghostbusters."
  16. Yorick

    Yorick Active Member

    Yeah, when the Columbia folks told Filmation that there would be no cartoon based on the Columbia Ghostbusters, Filmation thought, "Okay, well, we'll make a cartoon based on our Ghostbusters, then!" I'm glad they did.

    Of course, we know (secretly?) the Columbia cartoon was being worked on by DIC. But I like both Filmation series, as well as the 1984 Dan Aykroyd film, and the cartoon based on it...even the season focused on Slimer! :)
  17. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    We got 2 different but fun cartoon shows out of it. I keep feeling that if Filmation made the Columbia Ghostbusters cartoon, it would be their cartoon, but with the Columbia characters... and that wouldn't mix the right way. The Filmation Ghost Busters need the wacky ghosts and cartoony plot lines and the recurring big boss villain, Real Ghostbusters needed the science and cultural themes that were explored by Dan Akroyd since the beginning of the movie's development. 2 great shows with 2 different themes.
    Yorick likes this.
  18. mupcollector1

    mupcollector1 Well-Known Member

    I wonder if Frank's script will be the one he wrote with Jim Henson and Jerry Juhl in the 80s "The Cheapest Muppet Movie Ever", the plot with Gonzo directing the film and going over the budget for the opening titles so the rest of the movie gets cheaper and cheaper. LOL Or if it's going to be an all new script. Either way, I can't wait. :)
  19. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I wouldn't doubt it was that one, and the reporters scrambled their info. If Frank Oz was currently working on a Muppet Movie Script, we'd know it. If we can hear faint rumblings of someone producing a script, we'd hear of Frank's script loud and clear.

    The fact of the matter is that, even though they had the script Jason was working on, they announced Cheapest at a D23 (which the only thing they correctly predicted was a Hallmark ornament and a line of Ugly Doll type toys that didn't last long). Now, there's nothing that said that they were actually reworking that script (if one even exists)... and even if they were, they'd use the current Muppet team to punch it up, not someone who's in another state of their career. Among other things, Cheapest would have been a terrible way to relaunch the Muppets... it's too experimental a concept. It would fly after TMM, GMC, and MTM... not so much as a launching pad project.

    The Muppets WAS the film that needed to be made, better or worse. Now that it did as well as it did... impressive only due to the fact the box office was weak the following weeks after the film and that several other children's films with higher budgets were released in a week and a half long period (some of those movies didn't even make worldwide what The Muppets made nationally in the first week), they can make any film they want.
  20. Mupp

    Mupp Member

    If nothing else, now that the film has been pretty successful, perhaps now they will be willing to try Frank's script idea for the next project.


Share This Page

Visit the Sesame Street Store Today!