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Kermit at the MTV Video Music Awards

Discussion in 'Muppet Appearances' started by theprawncracker, Sep 13, 2009.

  1. theprawncracker

    theprawncracker Well-Known Member

  2. Blinky_Fish

    Blinky_Fish Well-Known Member

    Jamie, Sadly He already is the empty icon... And I know that is a hard thing to swallow, but the minute he was pimped out for that Ford commercial, the Target ads... He became a Billy Mays.

    The kid-i-fying of the Muppets I think, is the most hurtful thing. Kid-i-fying is for Sesame Street. Someone should convey that.

    And not that I am against the "Seasoned" performers and quality performances argument - everyone has the off day and we all need to remember MCC when Steve was just getting hold of Kermit himself.
  3. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    I disagree.
  4. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    I disagree as well. I do not feel Kermit was off at all in MCC. Perhaps in a few appearances prior, but I think that from that film forward, Steve had Kermit, and he get better and better every day.

    Kermit's appearances in commercials never turned him into an empty icon. Did Harrison Ford become an empty icon appearing in commercials in Japan? Is Catherine Zeta-Jones considered an empty icon now? How about Sarah Jessica Parker? William Shatner? Naomi Watts? Zach Braff? James Garner? Are they empty icons? No. They're celebrities. Celebrities lend their image to the promotion of products. It's what they do and keep themselves in the spotlight. Kermit is a celebrity, and as with any celebrity, it hurts his image if he's not always in top form.
  5. SarahOnBway

    SarahOnBway Well-Known Member

    Sorry to jump back a page, but nobody really commented on the two posts that happened in a row back there. The first (above) but a first time poster, and the 2nd being a 2nd time poster, both saying Artie performed both the voice and the puppetry at D23 for Kermit.

    Now, I don't have x-ray vision, I can't see through steamboats, so I have no idea WHO performed the frog that day. I will say, however, that if the performers were singing live, it goes against, not only the video evidence, but all the usual ways the Muppets perform live. They ALWAYS "lip-sync" to previously recorded tracks. Back to The Muppet Show (the exception being the certain guest stars who wanted to sing live). Look at Dave Goelz for example: on that boat is Gonzo, Bunsen and Zoot. How could Dave possibly provide the voices for all three characters at once? And earlier in the video clip we have, Gonzo's mouth was COMPLETELY off from his voice--there's no way Dave was doing both at the same time. I've never seen him be that off.

    If Artie was the person manipulating Kermit, which he may be, as I said before, can't see through wood, but if so, where was that kind of skillful puppetry on AGT and at the VMAs? Something about this just doesn't sit right with me.
  6. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    The whole thing is becomeing a huge mess. Everyone is trying to put things together that don't fit, and getting rumors mixed in with the little known truth we know.

    The truth is we have no clue who did the Expo, unless someone who was working backstage came here ans told us we don't know.

    I know that everyone is worried about Kermit and Steve, and we all want to know what is going on. We need to be careful however. So many times fans will say things to help answer questions, but unless your are 100% sure of your facts don't say anything.

    This is an unsettleing time for Kermit and Steve fans, and I'm sure that whatever is going on it must me a triying time for Steve Artie and Muppet Studios. As much as it pains us we need to sit back be paitent wait and all of this one way or another will come out. Maybe not today maybe not next week, but it will.
  7. Luke

    Luke Well-Known Member

    We seem to have an abundance of new posters with inside knowledge of what went down at D23 ... strange. :confused:

    I agree the D23 performance was much better than any of the other recent Kermit performances, but that performance was looped not live - you can tell easily just looking at it. As to whether it was Arties voice on the recorded track, i'd be surprised if it was but if it is then that was a much improved job since AGT. It was great and magical to see the Muppets all back together again like that. I just also find it confusing how the same performer can go from being "off" in one performance, to being "on" the next, to being "off" again the very next night - just seems very strange. Though i guess maybe D23 was very heavily rehearsed and it was just Kermit sitting down singing.

    The people here are not really being negative but just giving their honest opinion. They just want the best for the Muppets, and its great Disney is putting this effort in, but if they have seen two or three things in a week they feel has been a let down and not of the quality they usually see then this forum is there for them to express that view or any other.
  8. antsamthompson9

    antsamthompson9 Well-Known Member

  9. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    I liked that a lot; it does sound like Jim, I almost did a double take.

    Sorry if some people didn't like it but I feel it was very accurate.

    And yes, I hope everything's OK with Steve.
  10. SarahOnBway

    SarahOnBway Well-Known Member

    The voice at the VMAs is definitely an improvement over AGT, but it's still... not Kermit. I mean, the timing was off, the way he held himself looked off, and he could barely compose a sentence. This is coming off as very harsh, and I'm sure it's incredibly difficult to improvise while hidden in a crate and raising your arm above your head and thinking about all the other things a Muppeteer has to think of... but that's why only the most seasoned professionals are given roles as large as Kermit. There's more to him than just his voice.
  11. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    I know what you mean about seeming rough, but still I really liked it, I wouldn't mind seeing this again. It wasn't just the voice that felt right; the vibe was just on somehow.

    I'm not comparing performers or anything, they're all professionals. Just saying it did sort of feel like hearing Jim again.
  12. muppets2

    muppets2 Well-Known Member

    I agree i actually kinda liked this kermit (way better than AGT)
    It almost sounded like jim but he was a little stiff:):eek:
  13. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Yeah I understand, well you know, I remember seeing one of Steve's first performances as Kermit in the early '90s and it was kind of stiff at times. It takes awhile to develop these things.

    This Kermit at the VMA's did impress me though. :)
  14. muppets2

    muppets2 Well-Known Member

    Yea i no it was just a huge improvement from AGT and he was pretty good (other than he was lady gaga's date)LOL

    He really impressed me not like AGT
  15. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Huh, interesting! I didn't see the AGT one so I can't comment. But this is all quite intriguing really! :insatiable:
  16. muppets2

    muppets2 Well-Known Member

    there is a link to the video in muppets on AGT thread or something like that
  17. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Ok, now I've seen it and can comment!

    I can actually see what both sides are saying. This performance was a bit rougher, needs polishing. I think also because it was singing, not talking.

    But I can also totally see where the performer is going with this. It does remind me of early Kermit, like back when Jim sang "Bein Green" in that stilted, quirky way.

    So, sorry guys, but I did find some promise in this guy's performance.

    Again, I do hope Steve is OK and all. I'm not comparing performers. We couldn't do what they do after all. :)
  18. muppets2

    muppets2 Well-Known Member

    yes it was okay but im just saying that he improved by the time he got to the mtv music awards:)
  19. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    I think part of the difficulty might have been that this was singing. The MTV clip is just talking and it sounded better.
  20. muppets2

    muppets2 Well-Known Member

    But he did talk when he handed the cd to the guy but i do admit it would of sounded better if he was talking. :)

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