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Saturday Morning memories thread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Xerus, May 7, 2008.

  1. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    Well, even if you don't like toy based 80's cartoons I think that they did have a lot of good role models..or at the very least, they made me feel better about myself and that I could do anything and able to deal with life in my own way well enough to have me become my own role model :). I think that is what every good cartoon should do and SSC, the ponies, and Rainbow Brite did that for me (RBB most of all did that in the Star Stealer movie IMHO).
    Shows like Bratz in the first place lack that heart, to say nothing of their being role models. It just does not feel like much effort is even put into their world or characters, unlike any 80's series I can think of off the top of my head...

    Now Winx Club is walking that thin line between I hate it and I will watch it on the weekend if I have nothing else to watch. I liked W.I.T.C.H. a bit more, but only just.

    Really given a choice I would pick 80's girly cartoons over todays any day, at least they had their characters worried about something bigger than going to the mall to shop for makeup :p. (This is why, even as a diehard pony girl I hate the new MLP cartoons. Forget role models, they have no conflict/plot at all!)

    As for my anime likes, I do like anything cute or funny, so I will look that up ^.^
    If it's sugary or sweet, I've most likely at least liked it a bit (expect Wedding Peach and Tokyo Mew Mew for some reason, I think it is because I am a lifelong Sailor Moon fan. And yes, I have seen magical girl anime before Sailor Moon to, but I still think she did it best, next to Princess Tutu)
  2. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Well I will say I liked Rainbow Brite, she was a great role model. All the boy guest stars underestimated her because she was a girl, but she proved them wrong, hehe. My Little Pony was occasionally too catty for me, but still good messages.
  3. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    Now that I look back on my childhood, most of the cartoons/tv shows I loved were for general audiences.... both boys and girls. The Muppets and Fraggle Rock are prime examples.

    Actually, I personally think there has always been a lack of quality cartoons for girls. It's like they try to hard to make everything sugarcoated and pink and fluffy. And it's not that I never watched those kind of shows, it just seems a bit insulting, now that I look back at those cartoons. Not all girls are into fluffy ponies and hearts and shojo sparkles. I'm glad that now there are shows like Kim Possible that feature a strong female lead and that the show doesn't talk down to girls... But even then, even in my teenage years, I couldn't relate to some of her teenage drama.

    I suppose cartoons marketed for girls must be quite difficult to write in that way. I defiantly think I prefer things marketed toward a general audience.
  4. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    I agree and I think that's true of adult women on TV too. It's always been hard and continues to be. It tells girls they're weird if they aren't all princess-y. And what's worse, parents (even mothers) think that's just fine. As long as it appears cute, they don't care if it's harmful.
  5. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    Something I've realized in comics, cartoons, live action TV shows, and movies is that women tend to fall into one of a few archetypal categories. (Examples: Femme fatale, romantic interest, nerdy chick friend, mother/grandmother... ect.) This applies to men as well, but they have many more categories to fall under. Actually, I saw an example of this in a book. It was really interesting.

    Anyway, what I was getting at is that I think it's up to creators to expand this. And we need more groundbreaking female characters.
  6. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    The thing is, if you look beck at the MLPs from the 80's apart from the babies (who were made to be cute, and I love them for it) a lot of their plots were about being more than fluffy, they saved their land from dragons, queens, witches, slime, and kicked serious tail when anyone wanted to make them slaves with their magical rainbow and horse-y powers, to say nothing of unicorn magic...
    I think it is easy to say anything from the 80's is too sugary or has no role models in it if you don't look at it closely...

    Where as some of todays cartoons do no hold up under a close look:p.

    As for sparkly anime, it is one of those things that you (and little girls) aren't limited to watching, as there are plenty of girl power anime IMHO. But at the same time, people that like such anime should not be looked down upon as not having good taste, or not having seen enough different types of anime...
    As an old school fan I have seen my fair share of a little bit of everything, and magical girl and mainstream anime is just more my cup of tea. So I am the first in line for fansubs of those :). And before anyone says anything, I do like some series better dubbed, because some of them do a great job now :).

    All and all I have to say I don't go to anime or cartoons for groundbreaking that much (although Princess Tutu did a great job at fairy tales IMHO) that is more of something I look for in books...

    I think what gets to me about most newer (2000 and later) supposed 'girl power' characters is that they spend so much time trying to rebel against things that they in themselves become an unrealistic stereotype with hardly any give or take :p.
    But, IMHO all of ones role models should not be from tv anyway, there are many in books...
  7. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    Don't get me wrong. I loved MLP and watched it every day. I had MLP toys and things. I know the ponies had their moments of being able to kick butt as well as being sugary sweet. However, it really seemed like cartoons of the 80s that were directed towards girls, this was... what went on. There wasn't a big difference in any of the cartoons. They were always ultra-colorful... Worse than a Skittles commercial... and fluffy and happy. I really shouldn't talk so much... I honestly, for one reason or another, wasn't able to watch things like Strawberry Shortcake, Rainbow Brite, or any other girl-oriented cartoon when I was little, so my comments could be completely unfounded.

    I just want a choice in girl-oriented programs. Can't girls have something a little.. I don't know... darker? Tomboyish without really being tomboyish?

    As far as anime goes, I love anime and will sing it's praises from here to next week. At least in anime, we get a variety of cartoons. While I don't personally like Sailor Moon (I used to watch it every day though) there are other anime that appeal to girls. And while I wouldn't say it's a shojo anime by any means, the Slayers has a very strong, spunky female lead in Lina Inverse.
    I'm not really a shojo anime/manga fan myself by default. Though I'll give anything a chance if it is good.
  8. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    I absolutely agree, like I said the '80s MLP had great messages and stories. It was just that some of the ponies reminded me of snippy girls I knew, lol. But other ponies and the humans were smart too and like you said the fantasy elements were fantastic. :)

    Well hmm...it's an old TV device. To take a minority that's been previously stereotyped and degraded, and instead make them all powerful and perfect. I don't think that method paricularly solves the problem. I do think we need rebellious girls, but they need to be realistic and identifiable too. :) And you're right, children should be encouraged to read more!
  9. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    You know, I keep hearing how girls lack a strong cartoon female role model, and I just can't help but think that Pepper Ann was an underrated show. It was billed the kid's equivalent of Ally McBeal (though I thought it was much much better than that little catty lawyer show). it was like Doug's female counterpart. And even a dude can enjoy it too. Characters like Milo, Deter, and the Principle (who was voiced by none other than Don Adams) really spoke to me...
  10. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    I heard good things about that show, but never saw it myself. I don't think I had the channel it came on.
  11. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    I've always loved color though..honestly I don't think being linked to being colorful is a bad thing at all, and I love happy go lucky as long as it has a plot, which even SSC did She kicked the baddies as much as anyone and had cute animals to boot... Rainbow Brite was based around giving all the world the bright wonderful colors we know in nature and not letting anything stop her in doing her job, which I thought not only made her a good character, but was an interesting modern myth storyline within itself. Colorful or not you hardly find little kids cartoons that put as much thought into their characters own worlds within worlds anymore, most of them are just boring 'our world but a tiny bit different' settings...
    I think good cartoons should focus on telling a good story before anything. Sugery or not most of my favorites 80's cartoons always had plots that were a matter of life or slavery or world saving and did a good job of things. If more cartoons were to take their characters bodies and minds out of the mall and what dress to wear and out there doing something character growth would naturally follow IMHO :).
    I liked Pepper Ann, but I only got to see a couple episodes, she reminded me of a girl version of Doug. Another newer show I loved and watched all the time was As Told By Ginger. I thought it was very realistic and she reminded me of me when I was that age...It is a shame that the 'ending' had to get as soap operaish as it did, but that is what school was like for better or worst IMHO :p
  12. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    I agree. Nowadays story seems to come last in many cartoons. Then again, many old cartoons never really payed much attention to story either.
  13. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    In the big picture I think many older cartoons at least tried harder and had more episodes with memorable storylines, if not great ones. I watch most of the new shows and I can't even remember what happened an hour later. A lot of them seem to lack any true emotion to, which is one of the reasons I first got into anime (when I realized a lot of the 'cartoons' I love when I was very little shared that new fancy label everyone was suddenly talking about:excited:)
  14. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    It depends. There are lots of old cartoons that look like they didn't try hard at all... Those Scooby Doo clones from the 70s for example. Scooby Doo didn't even have a strong story. Heck... Every episode followed the same story line. And while I'm not here to talk about how bad Scooby Doo was, I can't say anything about story there.
  15. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    As Told by Ginger was good, but I still couldn't identify with the girls. The bossy popular girl was funny though and I liked how she kinda liked Ginger, but couldn't admit it too much.

    But yes, in general cartoons used to have deeper storylines. And even if they weren't always deep, they were clever (i.e. Scooby Doo).
  16. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    I think it is one of those things like any other character, not everyone is going to fit into the shoes of everyone. But Ginger really was me at that age to a T and because of that I could see more of her depth I guess:)...

    And I agree with the clever part...It seems like even when shows try to make jokes now they are the 'hip but actually never was cool' type that have been used a million times, and they never really admit it or make fun of themselves :p. At less Scooby Doo knew it was campy :) (In a good way)
  17. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    At least to me, Scooby Doo Where Are You was enjoyable because of the characters... and I mainly mean Scooby and Shaggy. Though I don't really see it this way now (I understand the characters more) but when I was little, I thought everyone else was about as fun as watching paint dry. When I was younger, I couldn't care less who the person in the ghost costume was. The most prominent theme, mystery, just didn't matter to me... Especially because I knew it was always going to turn out the same way. Don't get me wrong... I watched it just the same but the story was a bore to me. I actually enjoy those movies from the 80s way more than the cartoon series. At least the monsters and ghosts were real! And I also remember liking the 13 Ghosts of Scooby Doo as well... even though that wasn't a very popular series either.
  18. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Yeah that makes sense. To this say I have trouble identifying with women on TV. April O'Neal was great, but I'd rather be a turtle, lol. The closest for me was Daria, loved her. :)

    Yup, they need to stop being afraid of looking silly and go for it. :)
  19. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    My all time favorite Scooby was A Pup Named Scooby Doo, I loved it's running gags and how it was more comedy based. It is a big reason why even now Velma is my favorite character and as adults I ship her and Shaggy in my mind :).
    And yes, I know the history of Scooby Doo and its roots for characters, but I think it has grown into something a bit more now:).
    I always pretended I was Mona Lisa, Raphs one episode girlfriend. But then, I always had a thing for him^.~
    Now that I think of it it seems like many cartoons are victims of the same sort of peer pressure their target age group faces everyday. They are afraid of taking a risk and making honestly funny or true danger facing fantasy series like back in the day because of ratings and parents. So they end up making 'safe' cartoons that are as interesting as eating glue :p (I never did that but I think it must be pretty boring^.~)
  20. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    I liked Scooby was A Pup Named Scooby Doo as well. I loved the cartoony style and the exaggerated personalities of the characters. It was an overall cute, funny show.

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