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Your Thoughts: The Muppets Season 1 Episode 102 - Hostile Makeover

Discussion in 'Muppet Headlines' started by Phillip, Sep 29, 2015.

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What did you think of "The Muppets" episode "Hostile Makeover"?

  1. Absolutely positively! This episode was great!

  2. Bork bork! This episode was good.

  3. Mee mee. This episode was so-so.

  4. You're all weirdos! This episode was disappointing.

Results are only viewable after voting.

  1. Blue Frackle

    Blue Frackle Active Member

    Not to beat the point over the head, but they look like the Muppets, but they aren't really the Muppets. It's like if you took your body and put someone else's brain in there, it's no longer you. I am not saying this to complain about the new show, but these are just the facts.

    It's like they could either retire 'The Muppets' completely since Jim is no longer the brain behind them and most of the old puppeteers are gone, or they could live on as they are now; which would you rather have? It's a really tough question. Retiring ensures quality and an untouchable legacy, but there would be nothing new.

    It could be better, but it could definitely be much worse. They aren't doing that bad of a job with them. Jim said "If the audience wants these characters to live on, they will". It's really like "If Disney wants these characters to live on, they will". But it's a joint effort between the audience and the creators.

    Here's another hypothetical. I think we can all agree on this: The Simpsons in its prime, that's as good as television gets right there. All original members are still doing that show but it is beyond stale at this point and needs to stop. Who's to say if Jim was still "running the show" it wouldn't be dry? But he would also probably be retired now with minimal involvement in things. Maybe a reboot in new hands is healthy and a necessary change to keep things fresh.
     
    Ruahnna and WebMistressGina like this.
  2. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    FRANK OZ!!!!!
    They need Frank........Not as a performer not as a director, but as a creative overseer just like he was during The Muppet Show. It was said he would sit in on writers meetings and just start marking away at the jokes he thought would fall falt. Frank was and still is very character driven. He could turn this show around to where not only would it be edgy but the characters would be themselves, and the relationships would work. The sad thing is after years of saying he dose not want to be a part of the Muppets, he has recently said he might would like to come back. Disney however has not contacted him
     
    Ruahnna and heralde like this.
  3. Duke Remington

    Duke Remington Well-Known Member

    No, they do not.

    The show is working out just fine as it is.

    Please stop relying too much on the old guard and don't become one of those irrational and uneducated haters. :rolleyes:
     
  4. D'Snowth

    D'Snowth Well-Known Member

    Grow up, man; you've finally sunk to a level of a pot calling the kettle black.
     
    terrimonster, Ruahnna and dwayne1115 like this.
  5. Duke Remington

    Duke Remington Well-Known Member

    They are not the wrong writers! They're excellent writers and great choices for the show. :rolleyes:
     
  6. Erine81981

    Erine81981 Well-Known Member

    I agree with everyone who has enjoyed the show. It's really good I don't see any problem with it. Yes hardly any of the older puppeteers aren't there but that doesn't make it not The Muppets. They are still the same but they have grown with newer puppeteers. That's how I see it.

    Some older fans who grew up with Jim at least during the old show are enjoying this show too. I grew up with the older reruns during the time Jim was around. Now yes I would have never had known about Jim till about the age of 6 or 10 but I knew who he was. I was sad when I found out my hero had passed away. Even my Granny called me to see how I was and ask if I knew what had happened. I still see them as they were 30 years ago. But I understand everyone has their own opinion. I know where you are coming from.
     
    Duke Remington likes this.
  7. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    Alot of the haters on this forum are not uneducated. I love the new show,but at the same time there are things i see that are terribly wrong with the characters. In particular Kermit., and his lack of respect for the other Muppets. I won't say he is being mean I just think he does not care for them as much as he ues to. Lieing to Fozzie and setting up Piggy is kind of out of character for Kermit. I mean I could see Rizzo or Pepe doing that, but not Kermit. So ya know you can call me us haters,but don't call us uneducated!
     
    Ruahnna and heralde like this.
  8. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    You almost talk as if you are one of the writers.
     
  9. Duke Remington

    Duke Remington Well-Known Member

    I completely disagree. That is all. :grouchy:
     
  10. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    That's fine but you don't have to be so rude about it. You can think one way and others will think there way.
     
  11. MuppetsRule

    MuppetsRule Well-Known Member

    This one sentence pretty much sums up how I feel about the new show. Trying to "humanize" the Muppets is just totally the wrong way to go. Why have the Muppets if they are just going to play some character basically? You could have hired any actor/actress and assign them the individual Muppet's personality. You could hire Neil Patrick Harris as the late night shows producer instead of Kermit and given him the same lines and personality as Kermit for instance. I just don't get why they are using the Muppets if they aren't gong to be the Muppets. And now there is word that there aren't going to be talking vegetables or Gonzo's chickens because they don't fit with the whole humanization thing? What do you think makes the Muppets the Muppets? It's the singing chickens, the zany penguins, the fridge full of talking vegetables, the Lobster Banditos, etc...

    But what do I know? I'm just one of the old irrational, uneducated haters.
     
    Ruahnna, heralde and Blue Frackle like this.
  12. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I'm sorry, but the logic is still the same "WAAAH! This isn't a complete copy of a show Jim Henson himself ended after 5 seasons because it would have got stale."

    I'd much rather them being humanized than have them flop around going through the motions and rehashing their old jokes in a photocopy of a photocopy Flanderized sort of way. Seriously, if they made a new Muppet Show that's exactly like the old one, we'd be complaining that it wasn't as good as when they did it in the first place anyway. Such is the Geewunner mindset. They'll out and out refuse to like anything new and find reasons to pick it apart so no one else can enjoy it.

    Not saying anyone has to like the show, but really? Anything wrong with this show is the same thing wrong with every project since MCC.
     
    Duke Remington likes this.
  13. heralde

    heralde Well-Known Member

    You're right. Remember in the 60 Minutes episode when Richard Hunt said the Muppets' jokes wouldn't work with human beings? Well the reverse is also true. The jokes that work with humans don't necessarily work with the Muppets. That doesn't mean the Muppets aren't adult or sophisticated. It just means they're different. And that needs to be recognized.
     
    Ruahnna likes this.
  14. Oscarfan

    Oscarfan Well-Known Member

    So, they can't really have chickens and talking vegetables.

    OH NO?
     
    Ruahnna likes this.
  15. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    I could give a Frog's fart about chickens,talking vegtables, minor or background characters, or even new random whatnots, or newer characters from the last two movies ever showing up on the show! I just want to see the original Muppets to be a little more in there orignal character
     
  16. Ruahnna

    Ruahnna Well-Known Member

    I have to say-again--that I am sad to find you uncivil in your expression of your opinion. Being rude rarely convinces anyone.

    Denying reality rarely convinces, either. Kermit is different. He is mean. He is shallow. He is dismissive of old friends and calculatingly manipulative to others.
    Piggy, hailed worldwide as a feminist icon, is simply psychotic and dumb, divorced from reality and estranged from her frog. Fozzie has become morally untethered and grovels in a way that is unappealing. (Fozzie used to make us root for him when he bombed--now I just want to avoid eye contact.)
    And Scooter, who had grown and changed from an annoying teenage wannabe with people skills into a dependable and trusted assistant, capable of managing impossible schedules and impossible stars&-well, he's now the groups enabler-in-chief. He props up Kermit and supports his bad decisions, such as overeating and getting his portly self involved with a younger, more servile pig. He has gone from being the band's manager to being their "supplier." I want to cry when I think about it.
    Gonzo isn't even really there.

    The problem isn't that the old (performing) guard is gone. The problem is that the new people and the old people and whoever the heck the "people" are who are writing for this show don't know who the muppets are. They don't understand what makes them tick (see my post above about how Kermit's worst fear about Fozzie become the bear's defining characteristic).
    In The Muppets, Kermit acknowledges that he is lost without Piggy, and the gang is lost without him. The crowds stood up and cheered. On the backs of that success, a sequel was born. The second movie, in which none of the other muppets seem to notice that Kermit has been replaced by a disaffected criminal, would NEVER have launched another movie.
    Believe me--we NOTICED Kermit was missing. We see that he IS missing.
    The irony here is nothing short of staggering. Constantine didn't do as much to damage to muppets as Kermit has managed to do in two shows. And sadly, while I find this version of Kermit repellant, I know it isn't really Kermit's fault.
    His fate is--literally--in the hands of others, and they have let him down and left him hanging.
    Irony. And sadness.
    For me, who loves them wholeheartedly, the question isn't hard to answer: do I wish they hadn't come back to television?
    Yes. Absolutely.
    The main characters, as portrayed in the first few episodes, are unsalvagable unless they fix the major flaws in the writing: ignorance and meanness.
    Even Gonzo could do better than this.
     
    heralde likes this.
  17. Ruahnna

    Ruahnna Well-Known Member

    You act as though it is impossible to find the old spirit of the muppets portrayed in new and appealing ways that would attract audiences. Just because the current projects haven't managed to do it doesn't mean it can't be done. (Who the heck do they think they are--Jerry Abrams, the demigod who set out to "fix"
    Star Trek and ended up borrowing from the old version so shamelessly that it was an embarrassment.)

    There are writers who could do a better job. Heck, there are people all throughout the fandom who could write more credibly and more knowledgeably about the characters, not neglecting any of their rich history of relationships. And here's something I loathe to admit: the writers "the muppets" currently have could do it too--if they could be bothered.

    I'm not a hater. I'm not ineducated. (In fact, I seem to know the characters better than the current writer's do.). I stood ready to brace something new, but didn't like the way it scratched and bit me.

    I don't dislike the new show because it's not the old show. I dislike it because it not funny, it's disrespectful, it's out of character and it's mean.
     
    dwayne1115, MuppetsRule and heralde like this.
  18. MuppetsRule

    MuppetsRule Well-Known Member

    Pretty much agree with all of this, although I don't find them repellant. They are, afterall, still the Muppets. I'd like to think that somewhere deep down there still exists all that makes the Muppets good.

    Next weeks show should be another nail in the coffin. From the previews the Muppets go out to the bar, sing karaoke, stay out late, and then fail to show up for work the next day. These writers could not be further off than how they are treating them.
     
    Ruahnna likes this.
  19. dwayne1115

    dwayne1115 Well-Known Member

    I understand what the both of you are saying. I love the show,but i agree with what your saying. I think you two are great fans, who just want the best forand out of the Muppets. To me I think they are trying to hard to be different,and that makes them look fake.
     
    Ruahnna likes this.
  20. antsamthompson9

    antsamthompson9 Well-Known Member



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