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Muppet Wizard of Oz - Positives and Negatives

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by Mo Frackle, Aug 27, 2012.

  1. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    For me it only made me see why I dropped them for 12 years. I didn't care for MTI or MCC because I just don't like them role playing but I could still find more redeeming qualities in those films then MWO.

    No offense to people who actually like it if you did that's great however this is one film that was just an epic fail to me. And that's just how I personally felt about the film.
    heralde likes this.
  2. beatnikchick300 Active Member

    Well, on the plus side, I liked most of the songs, Johnny and Sal were awesome, as always, and I actually thought the Tarantino cameo was pretty funny. Other than that, it blew. :p
    Pinkflower7783 and jvcarroll like this.
  3. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    I did watch this movie a few times in the past though just to see if I'd feel different about it but nope. Although I did think Gonzo made a cool looking tin man.
  4. DannyRWW Well-Known Member

    I agree with the comments about the bad out weighing the good......the funny thing is I only watch thsi when the kids want too ***sigh**** I still think though there are some good elements to it...just not enough....
    Mo Frackle likes this.
  5. DannyRWW Well-Known Member

    Hey new positive...this movie was so horrible it finally got the muppets away from retelling stories
    Hubert, Drtooth and Pinkflower7783 like this.
  6. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    That was the trouble for me usually even if I don't like a film I can at least try to find something good in it but this was just one I just couldn't and I did try. I'm not the type who just because I didn't like it the first time just shelve it and never give it another chance because I must've watched this film at least 4 times. I mean like I said I didn't even care for MCC and MTI but I was still able to find some positives in those. MCC oddly enough I just gave another watch recently after not watching it for several years and I think the film might've grew on me a little. This one just didn't.

    I'm not ripping this film apart to be smart but there was just nothing there for me. I mean I personally liked VMMC and I know a majority on here really didn't like that film at all so...*shrugs* everyone is different and will like different things. I should note the Wizard of Oz is one of my favorite stories so in the beginning I was actually pretty excited to see it done in Muppet form but once I watched to say I was disappointed was an understatement.
    heralde likes this.
  7. Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Hey, I loved VMX. That's what was wrong with MWOZ.... they tried too hard to make that film again, getting that same Simpsons/early Family Guy pop culture, genre savvy feel and just completely missing the mark. Sometimes trying too hard shows. VMX seemed more organic. Plus, if you take away the pop culture references, deep down, there's a satisfying character study... Kermit emotes for the first time in quite a while and actually acts like Kermit. Plus there was that heartwrenching sequence of alternate world Piggy being a depressed lonely failure without Kermit. I don't see why more people don't acknowledge that as a strong portrayal of the Piggy/Kermit relationship.

    Actually, speaking of Piggy as the villain, I thought about the time she was given the villain role as The Wicked Queen in Muppet Babies. Her evil was fueled by jealousy of not getting the role of Snow White and NOT being able to play damsel in distress opposite Kermie. I really wish they worked that into the movie... a short meta sequence (like the "you're overacting" bit in GMC) where Piggy and Kermit have an argument about her being the Wicked Queen. Something along the lines of "Yeah, but you wanted to be all the witches. You said it would be wonderful to play 4 roles in a single film." And having Piggy respond to "that's before I remembered how close Dorothy is to the Scarecrow in this thing." Capped off with one of any given character saying "uh... yeah, we're still filming." Something like that could have saved the entire film for me.
  8. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Wow I couldn't have said that better myself. Brilliantly said DrTooth!
  9. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Kind of funny how in VMMC you saw how Piggy wouldn't be anything without Kermit. And in the latest film it's Kermit realizing he's nothing without her either. That's one thing I liked about VMMC is that Kermit and Piggy finally seemed to act like they knew each other again. Or at least Kermit showing he cares about her somewhat. Cause I didn't see it at all in MFS.
  10. Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    The thing about MFS is that it sort of went back to Kermit's "professional relationship" with Piggy that he used to talk about in interviews. The way I see it, since MFS was a Gonzo (and to a certain extent, Rizzo) driven story, I really didn't think it was necessary to have the whole Kermit-Piggy thing going on in the movie. They're in love, yes, but that doesn't always have to be the center of attention. Kermit's reactions to Piggy's job in MFS seems to lean back to the old days of TMS where Kermit would react to Piggy's diva attitude. "Sheesh, there she goes again".
  11. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    Hmm...while I agree it was a Gonzo movie I will have to disagree with you. To me in MFS it looked like him and sounded like him but to me he wasn't Kermit. And I dont think Kermit & Piggy have to ALWAYS BE the center of attention but you can't deny that that's not one of the main appeals of the Muppets whether your a fan them or not. That was something Jim Henson always made sure of in all three movies was that their relationship was an important part of the stories. And then when he past it got pushed to the back for 12 years. I'm not saying it's the ONLY MAIN appeal to the Muppets because there's so many other important things besides Kermit. But it is an important one. And I'm not even talking about just Kermit and Piggy but he showed little concern for Gonzo as well.

    As I've said before Kermit himself said that MFS was not the last movie you wanna do you want to do a better one. Anyways back on topic...
    Mo Frackle likes this.
  12. Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    That's a really good point. For that matter, is it just me, or did none of the Muppets really seem to be all that close in MFS? Gonzo and Rizzo have a few little moments, sure. And I see what you mean by Kermit not showing much concern for Gonzo. Sure, he has a few little moments (concerned about Gonzo's safety after he's kidnapped, worried Gonzo might have finally lost it, etc.), but one really would expect much more from Kermit.
    Pinkflower7783 likes this.
  13. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    I expected much more out all of them. Not just Kermit. That was one film that had the potential to be something really good. However this was the same director who did Alvin and the Chipmunks and Hop. Need I say more?
    Mo Frackle likes this.
  14. jvcarroll Well-Known Member

    Muppets From Space seems to have been invaded by pod people. Many of the characters don't seem right. Kermit is detached for most of the film. Miss Piggy doesn't share even one romantic glance at her frog the whole picture. I understand Gonzo's doubt and inner-journey but he didn't have enough zany moments. He's Gonzo! And don't get me started about Fozzie. Did he take a Sudafed before coming to set? MFS has some great scenes and a few touching moments, but it lacks the spark and charm of the 6 other Muppet pictures.
  15. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    I hate say it but Kermit might as well of just been a puppet. :p
  16. Mo Frackle Well-Known Member

    I think we need to start a "Positives/Negatives for MFS" thread.
  17. Vincent Liu Well-Known Member

    I doubt we even need one since it's already being talked about so often here. :p
    But yeah, make one.
  18. Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    There's already a thread on here about what went wrong with MFS.
  19. jvcarroll Well-Known Member

    I think every Muppet movie/special should prominently feature the Electric Mayhem in a musical number. That hasn't really happened since Muppet Family Christmas. Well, Studio DC, but we'll overlook that.
  20. Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Thanks. I was going to mention the comic book Muppet Snow White where Piggy voluntarily chooses to be the Wicked Queen to show her acting depth, but got insanely angry and jealous when she realized that Kermit was playing the prince, and what's worse, Spamella Hamderson was playing Snow White. But that came out over 5 years after MOZ, so it's just a hindsight thing.

    Side note: If they ever want to another Classic Retelling, get the guy who wrote that one. It's like MCC the way it SHOULD have been.

    EHHH! You forgot the "Rock and Rollin' around the World" number at Muppets at Walt Disney World. The ONLY time they had Clifford as part of the band in a kinda sad what could have been in hindsight.

    But yeah. I understand the time constrictions and the way too much crammed in for more aspects of the new movie, and the fact that they haven't been fully recast until those DC specials... but next film NEEDS a strong EM number. As far as MoZ goes, Naptime, as meh as it is (and it's the second best song in the film) is the furthest they got in years. Even though it was just repeating "Naptime" rhythmically. Much better than the background gig in MCC. I did like the "Don't argue politics, just play the gig" bit in MTI, though. Still, I wish they did more in "The Witch is in the House" than just accompany...

    But that is the ONE positive thing I can say about it... The EM were back to a bigger extent than the previous films and specials.
    Pinkflower7783 and jvcarroll like this.

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