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Your Thoughts: Kermit and Miss Piggy on America's Got Talent

Discussion in 'Muppet Appearances' started by Phillip, Sep 1, 2009.

  1. Daffyfan4ever

    Daffyfan4ever Well-Known Member

    Well, that's good. Hopefully Steve will pull a June Foray and protest before the next time they try to give the frog to anyone else. :)
  2. lynxminx

    lynxminx Member

    The AGT segment is up again:


    Now I understand why everyone was hypercritical. The Kermit performance here is weak on all counts. Painful to watch. :(

    Still, I'm not sure the "set in stone" policy will be best for the franchise. If Jim had lived longer, he probably would have adopted an understudy...instead, Steve had to take over without the benefit of Jim's insight, and he admits this was a struggle.

    On the other hand, the only thing Eric Jacobson seems to have taken away from Frank Oz about Miss Piggy is that she's a truck driver in drag. Of course Oz is a wiseacre, striving to defy interpretation...imagine if he had *wanted* Jacobson to get it right.

    (I'm not criticizing Eric. Lately he's been spot on, a joy to watch...it just took him a while to get there).
  3. Mupp

    Mupp Well-Known Member

    Well, as Steve said "Its behind us" :)

    Yes, it was unfortunate for Muppet fans to see it happen. But if it helps, just imagine that Kermit had a cold during that performance.
  4. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    ...and that he was on cold medicine. ;)

    I'm glad that the matter's been sorted.
  5. ekuska

    ekuska Member

    Its not easy being mean..

    I listen to the muppetcast when I can, and I jump around the 100+ shows that Steve has posted. And I kept hearing about his dismay on this 'Kermit appearance'. And tonight I listened to the Whitmire interview and they discussed this yet again.. Intrigued, I hunted down the video and found this huge discussion going on here.

    And Im not sure where all the animosity and vitriol is coming from.. As one put it, "it sure felt like Kermit" and I totally agree. Ive spent the last 19 YEARS missing the Kermit Ive grown up with.

    And lately Ive been bewildered at Kermits swipes at Miss Piggy and his taunting of her that seemed out of place to me. Kermit I knew was a nice, polite, kinda dull guy. And 'Americas got talent' Kermit was nice, kinda quiet, and actually sounded like Jim. And it was really comforting to me.

    I guess its kind of like Johnny Carson vs Leno. Or David Lee Roth vs Hagar. Maybe even your dad vs a stepdad. We all have soft spots for the people we grew up with. They are comforting because they are familiar. But change or alter them and you feel kinda betrayed..

    As for me, and this sounds like plenty of other 'pre 1990' muppet fans, it was so comforting to hear my 'Kermit' of the 70's again.
    And I assume if you grew up with a different kermit, you would have grown attached to that vocal range and mannerisms. And I understand your alienation. But all I can say is that was some of the best Kermit Ive heard since 1990..!

    As for the performers, I have huge HUGE respect for Steve Whitmire. The guy went into an incredibly talented and tight group of creative genuises, and held his own. He was just a kid! Can you imagine the awkwardness of being the 'new guy' around Jim/Frank/Jerry/Richard? Yet Steve grew tremendously and is now one of our master muppeteers.. His talent and hard work were pivotal in that, but also the support and encouragement he received from Jim, Frank, Richard and the rest.

    To the performer of the new 'Kermit', I encourage you to keep going! I cant imagine the nerves to perform such an icon, but I thought you did an outstanding job. And I have a feeling, in 19 years you will be as fiercely defended as Steve has been in this thread.

    good night to all, and thanks for reading my rambly reply. :)
  6. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    We’ve kind of moved on in this discussion, but it appears you haven’t been around for a while so welcome back to the forums! It's good to hear another take on this.

    Just to be clear, there is no New Kermit as has been stated in the MuppetCast. It seems Disney is sticking with Steve. Thank Frog!

    I think the majority of comments here have been fair and standard for forum chat. The replacement performer put in a noble effort, but Steve's Kermit is The Kermit now and has been good enough for this classic fan for the past 2 decades and will be until the day in the very distant future when Mr. Whitmire retires.

    The replacement Kermit wasn't better than Whitmire or more like Jim IMHO. He was just different and tapped into different things. Some worked, others didn't and everyone will have a different perspective. I never found Jim's Kermit "dull" or anything of that sort and he always made pointed remarks about Piggy. However, that's not all he was. Kermit was actually many things inside this simple little frog.

    The failed production fits and starts have crippled all of the Muppets' character development for quite some time, but the clips on Muppets.com and YouTube have started to change that. Animal now has a bunny roommate and Beauregard and Bobo have become a comedy duo. There are interesting things happening. I think they should keep going with the current arrangements and Muppeteer dynamics. It's a fragile thing and they really are getting it right in so many fantastic ways.

    In the end it’s about maintaining the integrity of Kermit. Steve has safeguarded that integrity since Jim’s passing and should be given the opportunity to do so until the torch is passed. I'm glad that Disney now seems to understand one-frog-one-voice.

    Just this frogboy's opinion on the subject. I like that there's new blood coming to the forefront of the Muppet dynamic. I just would like to see that in new Muppet characters we can enjoy for years to come rather than a needless recast.
  7. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    Despite being a kid during the late eighties into the ninties, aside from Muppet Treasure Island and Muppet Classic Theater, I grew up with Jim as Kermit. All I had were tapes of Jim as Kermit and the occasional rerun of The Muppet Show (when the TV would work). Actually, there really wasn't a whole lot during the ninties for a kid to become "more comfortable" with Steve than with Jim, so I think that's really an unfair analogy. I like Steve because I like Kermit, and I think he does a darn good job with the frog and maintaining Jim's vision for Kermit. But, ya know, that's just my opinion.
  8. theprawncracker

    theprawncracker Well-Known Member

    Right on, my man! :sing: I was born five months after Jim passed, but most of my young recollections of the frog are from The Muppet Movie or Sesame Street sketches. Honestly I never knew the difference between Jim and Steve when I would watch, say, Muppets From Space. In fact, I distinctly remember when I found out that Jim Henson had passed, I asked my mom how they kept doing the voices of Ernie and Kermit. I asked her if they just cut up and mashed together a bunch of audio recordings from Jim. :p

    But yes, Steve does an amazing job and he is Kermit now. There's no replacing him while he's still here doing an amazing job. :D
  9. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    UGH! Could you imagine? I'd say that's a million times worse than a bad Kermit impersonation any day.
  10. ekuska

    ekuska Member

    I have a feeling this discussion will go on long after Im gone.. Frogboy4, thanks for welcoming me back. Yes, it has been a while.
    After re-reading my post, I did not mean to overlook the incredible body of work that Steve has done. I guess me saying things like 'I prefer Jim's Kermit' is kind of a no brainer.. We all do, right?
    I just found it interesting that older members seemed nostalgic for 'Jims Kermit' and younger members fiercely defend 'Steve's Kermit'. Its what you've grown up with that often sways your opinions on things.
    Long live the frog, regardless who is performing, and I am excited and hopeful that new opportunities will be given to new puppeteers just as the torch was once passed to Steve.
    happy day to all.
  11. Daffyfan4ever

    Daffyfan4ever Well-Known Member

    It's alright. You're entitled to your opinion. It's just a little surprising that it's different from the rest of ours. I guess you're one of those people who feels that it's true some people felt that other performers could do a closer Kermit to Jim's Kermit than Steve has done, and that's okay. But the fact is that Steve IS Kermit and has been since Jim's death. I know what you mean though. Again, the day may come when Whitmire retires and Artie or someone else might start to perform :), but we're all hoping that will be a long way off, but in your case it would give you something to look forward to. It's hard to please everyone.
  12. Vic Romano

    Vic Romano Well-Known Member

    I'm glad this has been bumped because it is such a compelling debate. I really enjoyed rereading this thread because of the diversity, and I'd like to jump back in.

    First let me say I am strongly opposed to Steve–bashing, although I see that some people interpret replacing Steve as Steve–bashing, and I don't know that that is the issue. So as I said awhile back, in about 15 years, Steve will have been performing Kermit as long as Jim had. That's a fascinating point to me, because it could reason to stand that eventually, Kermit could be Steve's character more then he was Jim's in terms of experience. Assuming Steve performs Kermit up to, and past that time, and assuming Kermit would still be around in say 40 years (and there is currently no evidence to suggest otherwise), it's reasonable to assume Steve will no longer be able to perform Kermit. So my question to all of you is: at what point would you expect to see Kermit switch performers, to what kind of performer, and how would you prefer the exchange happen?
  13. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    For Steve to mentor the next performer, quite like Spinney is with Vogel on SS with Big Bird.

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