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17 Things Kermit has done that are worse than living in a mansion.

Discussion in 'Muppet Headlines' started by MrBloogarFoobly, Oct 24, 2011.

  1. Speed Tracer

    Speed Tracer Well-Known Member

    It's too late and my eyes are too heavy to comment on all of these things directly, but I have really loved reading this conversation, you guys. Everyone makes valid points, no one is claiming one truth - everyone just cares about this so much, and has something to say about why they care.

    One thing I will say - the Muppets are not characters. The Muppets are living, breathing entities. They can't be drawn the way the audience has come to know them, like Mickey or Donald or Goofy - they can only be themselves, and they, like human beings, have changed over time and will continue to change.

    It's good to remember that, as that happens, there is a very large group of passionate, intelligent people who will always love them at their best and their worst. Like you do when you love someone.
  2. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Well I don't agree that they aren't characters, in that I don't see characters as a bad thing. But to each their own. :) Still, even if they're not characters in the traditional sense, I don't want to watch a Kermit who has changed in the ways he has lately. Nor would I want kids to watch it, especially girls.

    But yes as others have said we don't know what the new movie will be like, hopefully they did improve on that.
  3. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    I swear that part of that has to be blamed on the writers or whoever, they've been taking this in a very obvious state for years now. Every Kermit interview somehow has to have that reference to the caustic relationship... I really wonder. is it really the fault of Steve and Eric or is it the fault of Henson at the time, trying to artificially bring back a retro Muppet Show season 2 because that's what they think people like. That's a Flanderized version of those characters people remember. yet, I don't see that in actual Muppet projects. It was sort of present in VMX at the beginning when Kermit lost it and somehow in the Moulin Scrooge number, but it really seems that that subtlety to the relationship was brought back. Too bad there was no room for that in their experimental MOz casting. LTS is hard to judge because it feels like there's a whole middle of the movie missing.

    It seems that this thing is forced upon public appearances and merchandise.

    Now, I think Eric has done a terrific job with Frank's characters (moreso the Sesame Street ones because that's constantly in production), but there is a subtlety lost in Piggy's character that Eric hasn't been able to find yet. And it's no help that people only remember Hi YAAAAH Piggy.

    However, this movie is being written by the masters of the relationship movie. Forgetting Sarah Marshal was a broad film about someone coming out of a wonderful relationship and how broken his heart and soul was when his long time girlfriend, who had a very positive influence on him at the beginning and how he dealt with it. Not like those cheap chickflicks where a modestly attractive woman has to choose between nasty idiot rich guy who her parents force her to set up with and someone played probably by Mathew MacCougnehey. Or "fat" girls finding love. And by fat I mean just under the at weight category (why do we need so many Bridget Jones movies). I have faith that they'll bring that great Muppet Movie Kermit/Piggy relationship back, where the only "Sheesh" is Kermit's Sheesh of "I love you a lot, but please reel in that enthusiasm a bit."
    Duke Remington likes this.
  4. Muppet fan 123

    Muppet fan 123 Well-Known Member

    Where did he get the money to live in a mansion I thought the Muppet Theatre was shut down and besides that even when it was still being used there was no money
    By the way doesn't J.P.Gross own the Muppet Theatre? Does he sell it to Tex Richman in the new Muppet Movie? If anyone knows from the book or anything please tell me, for some reason this question has been bothering me since I ever heard of Tex Richman owning the Muppet Theatre
  5. Muppetfan44

    Muppetfan44 Well-Known Member

    Couldn't agree with you more...I think Steve has been severely constrained with what he can do with Kermit because of his "new bosses" from time and time and it has definitely showed- completely sympathize with Steve, he's a great performer and that has to be frustrating. I never associated any of kermit's new character flaws with Steve's work- he does the best within the constraints he is given and I think we would all agree that Steve is vital to keeping the Muppets alive the way they should be.

    Yep, there were sometimes where I thought that Kermit could have been a little nicer, but you always somehow knew that no matter what he did, he always had genuine affection for the bear and pig that drove him crazy the most, and he could never hide it from anyone.

    I think this really broke my heart more than anything. I'm 25 so I didn't get to see the Muppet Show when it was actually on, but I watched vhs, dvd's, etc and I saw the way they were and when looking at recent work I became so frustrated. I could never understand, and a lot of times still don't, why if Kermit kept treating Piggy the way that he has for so long, who in their right mind would stay with him. I always sympathized with Piggy but also thought that the diva, supreme confident and talented role-model in her that I had as a child would never put up with it, but yet she always did and Kermit never changed...ugh it has been tearing at my heartstrings for so long!!! If this doesn't change soon.....well let's just hope that it changes!

    I think this is the thing that Disney is trying with all their might to keep under wraps until the movie comes out. I think the romantic dynamic between Kermit and Piggy is one of those things that is just so central to the success and vitality of the "reboot" of the Muppets. I also think that it's one of the things that Jason Segel really wanted to explore in the movie and he really doesn't want everyone to know how he plays it out until the movie comes out, which I think is the right way to go but like you Ru, I at times have my doubts about if they finally get this right for a change.

    Believe me, you are definitely not alone!!! :)
  6. Muppetfan44

    Muppetfan44 Well-Known Member

    Thanks Speed Tracer! I love it when I get a chance to have these types of conversations and I have always loved and respected Ru for the passion that she and I share for the frog-pig romance!!
  7. Muppetfan44

    Muppetfan44 Well-Known Member

    I wouldn't worry about it. It gets explained in the junior novel and I'm sure it gets explained in the movie- it doesn't really play as big of a plot point that the press has been implying.

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