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I don't like Clifford, do you?

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by Aaron, Oct 28, 2003.

  1. jediX

    jediX Well-Known Member

    I thought I saw Clash in the credits for VMMX....
  2. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    He did Sam's voice. :attitude: :)
  3. jediX

    jediX Well-Known Member

  4. Sidebottom

    Sidebottom Well-Known Member

    Was it actually stated that Teeth was their producer?

    All I know is that he appeared in the background during "Music Keeps Rolling Along".

    I really haven't seen very much JHH. Sadly.

    What an awesome show.

  5. jediX

    jediX Well-Known Member

    He's in the production booth, so it's assumed he had some involvement in their band at the management/production level.
  6. Crazy Harry

    Crazy Harry Well-Known Member

    That was kind of my point. When given the hosting job, he tried to run up the mountain so fast that he tripped and came crashing down.
  7. Aaron

    Aaron Well-Known Member

    and died
  8. turlem

    turlem Well-Known Member

    what was the wdw mayhem band? was it on a special? was everybody still playing their instruments? was rowlf in it?
  9. jediX

    jediX Well-Known Member

    No, Rowlf was in the dog pound at the time.

    As far as I know, here is the band in WDW:

    Dr Teeth-Keyboard
    Clifford...I'm not sure. I know he was there, though. Maybe he was in the horn section or something. I'll check this when I get the chance.

    Everyone sang in the song, "Rockin' All Around The World," even Zoot, strangely. The reason I KNOW Clifford was in the band then was I can recall his voice in the song, so I KNOW he had to be playing something. A second bass, maybe? Guitar? I dunno...but I DO know he was playing bass in Solid Foam (the band in JHH).
  10. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    No... just got busy with Elmo...
  11. BeakerSqueedom

    BeakerSqueedom Well-Known Member

    Cliff is Terrif

    <3 I ADORE the Clifford character! :excited:
  12. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    Years ago in this very thread I stated, "[Clifford] grew on me. First like a bad wart, then like a cute little freckle. Was that too graphic? :D " I stand by that for the most part.

    Clifford was kind of fun on the Henson Hour, but I used to find him needlessly more ethnic-influenced than the other Muppet characters. That's true, but I always wonder if it was a necessary choice? Now with Pepe's inclusion I can clearly see the value in it and am glad to have Clifford. :)

    The choice to have him host Muppets Tonight and be so regularly featured was a mistake. I felt not only that Clifford was taking over the Muppets, but I also felt he was pushing out Kermit and other beloved Muppet Show characters like Clash's Elmo continues to do on Sesame Street. The Muppet Show fan base didn't seem game for that and Clifford got the shaft. He has a place, but it was presumptuous of Muppets Tonight to stick him in that role before fans had embraced the character.

    Oh, and it's kinda cute now, but when it originally aired Clifford's "homey made of foamy" line made me heave in my mouth a little. Gross, but true. :coy:
  13. Reevz1977

    Reevz1977 Well-Known Member

    Not a fan of Cliffords in all honesty, theres something about him that just grates me. I thought it may be because I'm a purest, but then I remembered Pepé's one of my favourite characters.

  14. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    Mmm... Old threads.

    I personally like Clifford. I don't think I liked him at first for taking the lead role on Muppet's Tonight, but I have grown to accept it and say "You know, the Muppets needed that." It was okay to downplay Kermit as it was not long after Jim passed away. To have a Muppet Show without Jim Henson wouldn't be the same and at least in this early stage after his passing, Kermit needed a vacation.

    I don't see Clifford as a character who "took over the Muppets", but a guy who was filling in at a time when he was needed.

    And as an overall character, I like him. I'd go as far as saying that he is my favorite Kevin Clash Muppet.
  15. theprawncracker

    theprawncracker Well-Known Member

    Clifford is one my all-time favorite Muppets. I think Kevin's performance of him is brilliant, and he did a nice job holding stuff together at a time where things were mildly uncertain.
  16. Drtooth

    Drtooth Well-Known Member

    Well, it seems to me, every single problem with Muppets Tonight was conceptual. I rewatched some episode someone posted on Youtube, and I just can't help but feel that Kermit's character comes off as Producer that somehow interacts with the rest of the characters. they wanted someone hipper than Kermit to Host the show, and Clifford was what fit the bill.

    Looking back, I think they should have drilled the point in that Kermit was too busy to be on his own show, except for certain segments. It seeems more like a "Muppets: The NEw Class" than an honest to goodness sequal to The Muppet Show. I remember reading a quote on the muppetwikia page that said that they finally got the show the way they wanted to, in a place where it worked, after they finally cancelled the show.

    So, I really can't blame Clifford for taking over the show, so much as being the character that had to carry on the legacy of many characters who just weren't featured regularly. Oz's characters only appeared every so often, and Gonzo, Kermit, and Rizzo were the only regular classic characters to appear in every episode. Even Miss Piggy wasn't around too often. The burden laid with the new puppeteers like Bill Baretta and Leslie Carrara, so naturally, it would wind up focussing more on newer characters.

    Personally, now I miss seeing the character. Kevin is too busy with Sesame Street. Not just Elmo, but all the titles and duties he holds. His last appearance was a dubbed (or so I've heard) cameo as a bouncer in MOZ.
  17. TheJimHensonHour

    TheJimHensonHour Well-Known Member

    I like Clifford, I just don't like him as the host of Muppets Tonight.
  18. wiley207

    wiley207 Well-Known Member

    I also like Clifford, mostly when he has his sunglasses on, and when he's not the host of "Muppets Tonight." I could totally see him as a baby version in a modern-day Muppet Babies!
  19. MrsPepper

    MrsPepper Well-Known Member

    I love Clifford, he's great, and no other muppet looks or sounds like him.

    Plus has anyone seen his appearance from 1990 on Arsenio Hall on YouTube? You need to check it out NOW. It made me fall in love with him!
  20. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    Yeah. Muppets Tonight really seemed to be hitting its stride when it was cancelled. The Friday night time slot adjacent to Urkel didn't help - and it appears they kind of made fun of that fact, along with other outside tinkering, in the Grouper/Rickels/Coolio episode. :shifty: None of my college friends knew it was on or wanted to spend a Friday night watching it rather than going out. That was a big portion of their demographic! ABC didn't get that. This was all before the age of DVR when VCR recording was a pain. :concern:

    I know it was right to give Frank Oz first bite to dub his characters, but I didn't like it. They all seemed too stiff because of the total separation of voice to performance. Those characters needed recasting from the beginning and they now have that. Frank's work was always more about the puppetry and movement than anything else.

    Also, Kermit's lack of interest in the show was too jarring. I really think they should have just let Gonzo and Rizzo host the show and had Clifford be the band leader and a highly visible character that shared the burden of Gonzo and Rizzo. That's kind of how it appeared to be anyway. I guess they weren't ready for Gonzo to step up for that mature assignment, but that's where Rizzo evens things out. They could have always had Kermit directing from the booth in cutaway shots. :)

    Anyway, I think they went the Arsenio Hall route with Clifford. I liked seeing his eyes (sometimes) but the suits wore him rather than the other way around. It was a miscasting of a perfectly good character. I think Clifford is one of the most beautifully designed Muppets in color and shape. As far as performance, Clash's Clifford is most in his element when part of the ensemble rather than the main event. It's just more Clifford-like that way.

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