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Interesting Gulf War News

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Luke, Mar 15, 2003.

  1. punkNpuppets

    punkNpuppets New Member

    okay. i didnt read all the posts cuz i was lazy. but i read some of the first ones and a few of the last ones.

    ABOUT FRANCE - haha i wonder if american teens will start goin 2 the movie theatre and 'freedom kiss'!
    anyways, i wanna go 2 France! i hear theres this play that starts out with George Bush as a BABY talking about war and stuff!


    now i'm gonna get serious. theres this really rad website i found, its like a left wing site thats really anti-right wing. i want u all to see the front page - http://www.nopasaran.antifa.net/
  2. punkNpuppets

    punkNpuppets New Member

    dangit wrong link lol...I CANT FIND IT!!!
  3. BoyRaisin2

    BoyRaisin2 Active Member

    Shhh, no more speaking. I think no one remembers this thread. Quiet... ;)
  4. Mark Filton

    Mark Filton New Member

    Why do you bring up the nazis in your website link? Bush cannot be perfect, nor can any man please all people, but are we not free to post in forums? Where are the forums in iraq?

    The Soviet Unuin is dead, and it was never free. What point are you trying to make I could not never understand :smirk:
  5. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Re: This 'war'

    I'm always proud of our military and they are my heroes. Thank you, Byl, for everything!!

    BTW, WELCOME HOME TO MUPPET CENTRAL!!

    FOZ:o
  6. Mark Filton

    Mark Filton New Member

    What can you expect when some people like the Soviet Union of communists? There is no perspective when the comments come from a free land as we live in today.

    Where are the forums in communist countries?

    What about the man killed in Tiannemen Square by a tank.

    Some people get romantic about comunists, but I never do :eek:
  7. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    It's like I told a friend of mine: Stop taking freedom for granted and go live in that other country and TRY to live like he does here. He'll see a big difference in how he's treated---if he lives through it.

    A few years ago we (the Mid-South Cartoonists Assoc.) had a cartoon art show "Halloween Squared" at Overton Square here in Memphis. A portion of our art sales goes to charity, and our charitable event was to add to the fund to free an Egyptian cartoonist who was jailed by order of their President/King-guy because he drew a cartoon about the country's leader. The drawing and Essam Hanafy appear in our photos section:

    www.midsouthcartoonists.com
    photos
    album: Halloween Squared!

    Maybe this link will take you right to the album?
    Halloween Squared!

    Esam Hanafy, Egyptian Cartoonist IN JAIL.

    Jailed for THIS?!

    And THIS?!

    Man, folks take freedom too lightly. If USA was like this, there'd be no more cartoonists left.
  8. Cantus Rock

    Cantus Rock New Member

    That is horrible. Did he ever get released?

    Personally I like his work..heh.

    -Matt
  9. Mark Filton

    Mark Filton New Member

    Yes, very good cartooning :D
  10. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Honestly, I'm unsure if he did or not. I hope so, otherwise it's life imprisonment or death.

    All for a cartoon. hmph.
  11. wolfy

    wolfy Member

    I know I said I wouldn't post again here, but I do have to comment about this particular bit...

    Has anyone thought that, being in the Middle East, he may have had his hands cut off? Not only would that stop him from drawing cartoons ever again, but it would be a message of "deterrent" from the government in his country to other political cartoonists to not do what he has done...

    This is the kind of thing that our soldiers are hoping to end by defeating people like Hussian...although I don't know if they would be in time for this man...
    wolfy
  12. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Actually, while we were having the art show, I had 2 email contacts with him.

    I had forgot about that until now. I'll have to remind myself (good luck to me) to try to email him again to see how he is.

    IF he 'is.' Get my drift?
  13. Cantus Rock

    Cantus Rock New Member

    Unfortunately, yes.

    -Matt
  14. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Until right now I had forgotten to email him. Maybe I'll remember tonight.

    MAYBE!
    :rolleyes:

    We all know how well my...um...how well it works...that, thing in your head. You know, the noodles-looking thing you think with.

    Oh, yeah:

    Bangs
  15. Patty

    Patty New Member

    Let me just say right off the top: this is THE VERY LAST thread I wanted to post in. I lurk at MC more than post, but the topic unanimously brings out the worst in just about everyone, and that's not very muppety.

    However, you're talking about a cartoonist who was thrown in jail in another country. While this man was incarcerated because of a political cartoon, I think someone needs to say that the US occasionally tosses cartoonists in jail, too. So I'll step up to the plate.

    It wasn't even ten years ago that Mike Diana was thrown in jail in Florida on obscenity charges related to his comix. I've seen the artwork and I even met him at an art show once ... the work is unpleasant, that's for certain. Likewise, more than one person viewed his art as a form of personal catharsis.

    Whatever the case, he was jailed, fined, forbidden to draw (!?!) for some nutty span of time, and forced into psychological therapy at his expense.

    If there wasn't a need for it, The Comic Book Legal Defense Fund wouldn't exist. And they're busier than you'd think.

    I don't want to draw a direct comparison between the Egyptian and Mike Diana; that would be akin to comparing lower US wages for women vs. ... the Taliban's view of women. Still, let he who is without sin cast the first stone. The US throws artists in jail, too, from time to time.
  16. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Didn't know about that guy. Their main case back then was Essam Hanafy, which is how I knew about him. As far as the guy in Florida, for throwing him in jail for his freedom of speech is a direct violation of the Bill of Rights and, regardless which portion of the Florida State Government decided to prosecute, there's definitely a problem there.

    What did he do? A Hustler-type comic in a local newspaper or something? I could see where that might raise some problems, but not JAIL.

    It is preposterous that such a thing should happen, and I'm sure the Legal Defense folks are on top of it.

    Our contact with them was through a guy named Bro, and he suggested Essam's case to us to benefit. However, had we known up front that one of our own home folks was going through that, I'm sure the beneficiary of our proceed percentage would have been staying here at home.
  17. Patty

    Patty New Member

    The Mike Diana case was sheer insanity. He drew these kind of scribbly comix and photocopied them a la zine/ashcan. The only place carrying the comix was a local store in his Floridian hometown.

    We're talking about a zine that *maybe* sold fifty copies per issue. A hundred tops.

    The comix themselves showed ... like kids being assaulted and dismembered by giant praying mantis.' The stuff was pretty harsh ... very violent. But honestly, not without merit or artistic value. It's hard to explain ... Peter Kuper once wrote that the more you looked at the comix, the more interesting the art was, even though it might strike you as amateurish at first. Diana was really young at the time, but he's actually a pretty decent underground-type artist now.

    Regardless, someone saw the zine in a comic book store and gave it to the local authorities, who tossed Diana in jail. The court case dragged on for several years ... in the end he was found guilty of obscenity. Because obscenity falls under State law, not Federal law. And because the guy didn't have the resources to fight the case on a national level.

    That's one guy within ten years.

    If you go back to the 50's, you've got the whole EC Comics debacle, and that was even more insane.

    Cartoonists have a history of getting into hot water no matter where they live.
  18. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    Please list a link where we can research the details of the case (dates, parties involved, location etc). Thanks.
  19. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    Especially at bath time.

    That's why I chose Charles Schulz as my iconographic hero of cartooning and try to eminate him.

    wait, is eminate the right word? hmm...

    Anyways, regardless, as long as he wasn't being pornographic with his art of children, then there shouldn't be any other problem with what he did.

    The use of children in pornography, even in art, is illegal. Having them being eaten by giant bugs is not illegal, not based on some of the things Hollywood has done with kids.

    Also, there's the question of things in his personal life that may not have publicly surfaced that the authorities know about? Maybe not.

    Sounds like it's a clear-cut case of those idiot censorship folks who feel it's a necessity to shut down anything that doesn't directly reflect their own beliefs, the way Tipper Gore thinks, you know? I hate censorship and say, "Turn the channel, or don't read this magazine."

    The guy didn't deserve to go to jail, unless he's being pornographic while using chilluns.
  20. Patty

    Patty New Member

    Here's one link:

    http://www.cbldf.org/casefiles/diana.shtml

    And allow me to correct myself -- it did go to the Supreme Court ... apparently in 1997, which not coincidentally, is when I stopped working in comic books.

    I'm not going to post this other link because it's not suitable for this forum, but if you do a google search on "mike diana, boiled angel, court case," it's the second link.



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