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Lying Muppets

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by Hubert, Sep 18, 2012.

  1. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    I was recently reading this article, which is a very interesting article, by the way, but something left me raising my eyebrows:

    So a rule is apparently that Muppets never lie, forcing Segel to cut out a subplot where Kermit posed as an oil baron. Which is fine and dandy, until we remember that Kermit posed as a movie producer in The Muppets Take Manhattan. So where does that leave this commandment?
  2. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Yeah this is a good example of two things:

    1. The Muppets have no canon, no matter how much we may want them to, lol.
    2. Even the creators can get it wrong sometimes. ;) The most extreme examples of this were George Lucas and Gene Roddenberry. I'm not comparing the Henson crew to them, but it's the same sort of issue.
    Hubert likes this.
  3. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    Though I do agree with you, this technically doesn't have much to do with canon.
  4. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Well I just mean the idea that you could even have such a strict set of rules when it comes to the Muppets.
  5. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    True, true.
  6. miss kermie

    miss kermie Well-Known Member

    Moss Piggy has lied.
    More than 100 times.
    Take out of the commandments, or kick piggy out.
  7. Animal31

    Animal31 Active Member

    This could have been rules Disney put in place after the merger, I do not believe they had any involvement (or control) in the earlier movies, did they?
  8. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    They didn't, however I was under the impression that Disney was passing off these as rules from since the 70s or so.

    However, even if Disney did put some rules in place afterwords, shouldn't they have done some research to make sure everything held true to the Jim era?
    CensoredAlso likes this.
  9. HeyButtahfly

    HeyButtahfly Well-Known Member

    I was just thinking the same thing, hehe. That's pretty much essentially her character.
    Edited cuz apparently my grammar is bad today...
  10. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Not to mention when Kermit and Fozzie posed as pizza delivery boys in GMC.
  11. Animal31

    Animal31 Active Member

    Honestly, they own them now, whatever the rules were in the past really wouldn't apply for future projects. Besides, the movies themselves didn't have much of a continuity to begin with, none were really ever tagged as sequels so each one could have it's own set of rules.....
  12. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    Right, I understand that and know where you're coming from. I think you misinterpreted me...I was actually criticizing Disney, saying that if they did make up the rules, than they should have done their homework...
  13. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Such as decent dramatic devices like deception? ;)

    Again, this is like when Gene Roddenberry went around in later years saying Star Trek characters must be all perfect and non-military, which was complete nonsense and the antithesis of what he had created.
    Hubert likes this.
  14. RedPiggy

    RedPiggy Well-Known Member

    Wait, so the Muppets can't lie but "Muppet Man" doesn't count? And Kermit had been lying about his feelings for years, LOL. :)

    Why no puppet jokes when they are all over the place? TMS had lots of puppet references, especially on eps where different puppeteers make guest sketches. Also, in interviews there are a lot of not-quite-subtle jokes, such as "Jim really gave me a hand up in the business" and whatnot....
  15. Animal31

    Animal31 Active Member

    That can be said more times than I can count, for some reason the powers that be always feel the need to fix what isn't broken....Muppets, Star Trek, Godzilla! I almost feel as if they do it so they can feel the idea was truly theirs, like they made up something spectacular and didn't just buy it from the real genius'...
  16. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    That happens more often then people think. Franchises get passed on to a new team and they think they need to add their own stamp to things when really they just need to leave it alone, lol. Though there are cases, like Star Trek and Star Wars, where it's the creator who seems to have a faulty memory of his creation. Though nowadays we're more aware of the fact that there's rarely just one creator, just one person taking the credit. ;)
  17. snichols1973

    snichols1973 Well-Known Member

    In Muppets from Space, Pepe the King Prawn pretended to be Gonzo's "alien family", encouraging him to build a jacuzzi, which Pepe and Rizzo promptly enjoy, at Gonzo's expense.

    As soon as Gonzo meets his distant relatives and eventually decides to stay with his friends, it is at the end when Pepe and Rizzo share a laugh after Gonzo wonders why he was told to build a jacuzzi.
  18. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Yeah see even MFS, arguably one of the weaker films, knows the value of deception! :halo:
  19. charlietheowl

    charlietheowl Well-Known Member

    Maybe they meant that they didn't want to do any mean-spirited lies, I don't know. Regardless, when you start worrying about what is "Muppety" and what isn't "Muppety", the door closes on lots of creative opportunities and avenues.
  20. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    The thing is that I doubt Jason Segel's Kermit thing was mean spirited, as Kermit wouldn't do that. I would imagine that it would take the same avenue he did in TMTM.
    CensoredAlso likes this.

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