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Lying Muppets

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by Hubert, Sep 18, 2012.

  1. charlietheowl

    charlietheowl Well-Known Member

    You're probably right, but I can't think of any other reason that lying would be banned than for worries that it was mean or something.
  2. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Which reminds me Sesame Street recently concentrating on bright, colorful characters rather than ones with personality. :p
  3. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    I'm wondering if maybe whoever from Disney came up with that just assumed the Muppets would never do that and didn't even bother to check it out...
  4. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Well it said from the Henson crew, is that Disney? It's confusing, lol.
  5. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    It is, but we do have to remember that the writer thinks that they are all the same...
  6. charlietheowl

    charlietheowl Well-Known Member

    I can't imagine that the person who came up with the Muppet rules had not seen Muppets Take Manhattan, because that would show a lack of awareness that I don't think even Disney would approach.
  7. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    That is true...it's like, I really have no idea where this whole thing came from. It's kinda weird.
  8. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Eh, you'd be surprised at the lack of attention to detail of many so-called researchers, heh.
  9. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    And with Disney, you also have to take into account that being a big company, they don't always handle things in the most proper way.
  10. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Or it could just be part of the Henson crew that have a very generalized, idealized vision of the Muppets but don't have every film memorized the way we fans do. ;)
  11. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    I do think that there is a false idea out there with many people who haven't delved deeply into the Muppets that they always are goody goodies, if you will...
    Twisted Tails and CensoredAlso like this.
  12. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Yeah it's a very simplistic understanding of the franchise. The Muppets were always very innocent (even when being edgy, lol) but they were never goody goodies, lol.
    Hubert likes this.
  13. HeyButtahfly

    HeyButtahfly Well-Known Member

    ...Except for Bean Bunny
    Twisted Tails and CensoredAlso like this.
  14. Hubert

    Hubert Well-Known Member

    I mean, you have to admit, "the Muppets never lie" sounds really good...it is just so convincing that even I thought it was true for a second...the execution of the phrase just sounds so perfect that they are genuine...but then when you start thinking, you realize that they Muppets are a bunch of liars...:p
  15. CensoredAlso

    CensoredAlso Well-Known Member

    Wow, when you put it that way it sounds almost diabolical! :crazy:
    Twisted Tails and Hubert like this.
  16. Hartley

    Hartley Well-Known Member

    I've definitely seen interviews with Jim where he's been operating Kermit, and Kermit has made comments acknowledging that he's a puppet.
  17. Slackbot

    Slackbot Well-Known Member

    Muppets never lie? *laughs* Scooter must not be a Muppet them. The Sly Stallone episode cost him his license to mup.

    As for Muppets never acknowledging they're puppets, that may be true in routine work, although they've poked at the fourth wall (Kermit calling attention to his drinking through a straw) and, in fact, one episode of "The Jim Henson Hour" took a wrecking ball to that wall when the camera pulled back and the characters started freaking out because we could see their puppeteers. However, this is one commandment that Disney seems dead-set on keeping, even to the point of erasing arm rods. I don't mind the rods, but it seems like a slight to the puppeteer to not acknowledge their craft. It's kind of like refusing to admit that their non-CGI cartoons are a series of drawings done by artists.
  18. Pinkflower7783

    Pinkflower7783 Well-Known Member

    They also broke the fourth wall about being puppets in The Muppets Celebrate Jim Henson. As for the puppet rods they've been digitally removing them for years at least in the films. Their obviously still present during public appearances. I don't know why Disney is so funny about not letting people see the puppeteers. As cliche and cheesy as it sounds thats where the magic is.

    And as for the lying bit that's very laughable. If the Muppets were goodie good I garuntee you I would've never got into them in the first place. If that was the case that would make them too fake to me and make them unrelatable. That's part of the appeal to me their not perfect and they make mistakes just like anyone else.
  19. Ruahnna

    Ruahnna Well-Known Member

    I think that what actually caused this whole "thing" was that there was an original script that had Walter as a ventriloquist dummy, and the muppet folks said, "Oh no--no. We don't do that." And Jason was surprised and intrigued. "Really? There are rules for writing for the muppets?" (Because absolutely EVERYTHING seemed like fair game for the muppets.) And they rattled off some general, banal rules, which Jason then "quoted" in one interview--ONE INTERVIEW--and suddenly, there's a whole theory about the muppet rules. I think this whole thing was just a case of people taking one comment slightly out of context--several times in a row.

    When Jim was round, the "rules" were usually made up as they went along, and everything was fair game. No sacred cows (or pigs or frogs) allowed. Even the American Eagle got tweaked!
    The Count likes this.
  20. Muppet fan 123

    Muppet fan 123 Well-Known Member

    Just want to kinda clear this up
    Yes, Jim and Co. did write a book with rules for the Muppets and what they can and can not do. I think they realized that if another company was to go by these rules. I highly, extremely doubt lying was on it. We can sit around for hours and think of Muppets that lied.
    I think the reason why they didn't do it was becuase it was just a dumb idea, Kermit is really Tex Richman in a Tex R. costume? Nope. Doesn't really fly for me.
    I think part of the reason would also be becuase it would ruin kids thoughts on Kermit. If you said Kermit's not allowed to lie it'll make much more sense. But then we could probably think of times where Kermit lied too.
    Steve Whitmire said that if they were going to go with the script where Kermit is really Tex Richman then he does not have to credited on his work on the movie in the credits.

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