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Discussion in 'Muppet Headlines' started by Drtooth, Sep 6, 2007.
Ah, well, we all make mistakes.
Not saying it wasn't. That's why they did what they did. They bought the muppets, sadly, as a rebound. Now they have what they need, they can dump the rebound.
It's very sad they come out with nonsensical Baby versions of their own cartoons, when they have the real thing at their fingertips. Baby Pooh? Someone explain to me how a character that's just an imagined version of a plush toy can be a baby? Wouldn't Baby Pooh be a sewing pattern?
It's pretty pathetic to see all the other Muppet branches thrive. Sesame Street is making an all new non-PBS prime time special. A very bold move, since it's been almost 10 years since Elmopalooza. Henson's coming up with amazing stuff, even going into adult puppetry that makes Greg the Bunny look like a college student video. A Fraggle Rock movie? That was the stuff of dreams.
Now all we got are a couple box sets and some junk on the Disney channel. I would have even been optimistic with that if someone didn't say "Hey! Let's shove are prefabricated stars into them." Minimovies is a code word for using the muppets to further promote their tweencom line up. I mean, even if we got something like "Muppet Movie madness" they used to have.
I can agree it's sadly a while off for a TV pilot to go past that part. but HEY! Let's air those pilots. Call them "specials." Maybe that will show what needs to be done.
No. They're still wallowing in self pitty over the fact MOZ didn't break records left and right. it's the Muppet's fault for that one. not pathetic scripting, bad directing, horrendous acting and chemestry on the part of Ashanti, not the exasperating themselves with trying to get as many demographics as possible to like it.
so let me get this stright.... Muppet Babies like Kermit, Piggy, Gonzo etc. would also have been a sewing pattern? oh wait... pencil led same as the Disney Babies of Mickey, Minnie, Goofy etc. so some goes with the Sesame babys for the pattern! come lets get real... there pretend dude! (as MUCH as i love all of em, i like to pretend there real too, dont get me wrong.. im JUST sayin) its called use your imagination (or disney & seame tryin to make money) ither way i STILL think there cute! and if there makin money off it, theres no stopin it.
In the cartoons themselves Pooh is a doll. That's my point. Jim Henson (and Jeffery Scott and others) had a vision when they came up with Muppet Babies. Disney, Warners and the lot of them just saw big dollar signs by taking something someone else already did.
Baby Pooh is just another way I wish the A.A. Milne estate could get its rights back. I LOVED what they did with the movies and the cartoon series... but then they come up with all this garbage like "baby Pooh" products and "Pooh and Me" or whatever that CGI abomination on Disney Channel is.
I'm saying... why can't they stop making baby versions of everything when they have the real, quality Muppet babies show? They just leave it in the dark. The Award winning, high rated series that had been on for almost 10 years on saturday mornings, left in the dark.
It's true, in this world there are things that can be called genuine art and other things that just make money. I'm not saying which is which, and they sometimes overlap heh. But it is true that the quality entertainment is often what's disrespected. Sometimes it's frustrating to me. Other times I'm glad the things I enjoy are not wrapped up in the popularity nonesense. One important thing to do is to keep seeking our own interests (as long as they're not harmful of course), share them with others, and not let anyone tell you what to enjoy. Word of mouth can be a very powerful thing.
LOL! I laughed at Mickey Muppet's comment.
Certainly, they are.
Sorry, that was just very well said and I had to acknowledge it.
I actually wouldn't doubt that MB would make money, at least if they were to put reruns somewhere and put their likenesses on Baby Products. I've pretty much said in every post lately that we're not getting quality stuff, and we're just getting the same old junk because it makes money. Well, most of the time. There are times when going after imaginary focus groups fail.
Look at the Underdog movie. They would have got more money if they followed the cartoon closely,because they'd at least get the classic cartoon geek fanbase. But by alienating the only people who have heard of him, we're left with little kids who don't care about the character. Most of the target audence wasn't even born by the time they took it off syndication. And people who liked it that had kids would stay away. So it tanked the worst of all the Disney Live action cartoon films (even worse than Inspector Gadget). I can see the point of reintrodcuing something to younger audiences, but do it right.
This is why i said earlier that they should just rerun or put Muppet babies on DVD. Unless they got the original people involved, we'd have major problems reimagining it. I mean, when they reimagined TMNT in comic book style, they did a service to fans of the comics. I'm glad they didn't just make a remake of the older series, because it would just pail in comparison, plus we would have retreaded old ground.
But if they were to do anything to Muppet Babies, i'd be suspicious. I have horrible visions of them trying to make the show interactive, and Baby Kermit talking really really really s l o w. I see great kids shows like Word Girl and Cureous George coming out, but then I look at all this "Let's take the curriculum from Blues Clues and Dora" garbage and I shed a tear for Mr. Rogers. I could get into a big thing about it, but then it doesn't differ from what I've been saying with SS the last several years.
As for the Muppets, I'd at the very least be happy if they confirmed the last 3 seasons of TMS, and some sort of set for MT. If they can at least get that together I wouldn't be terribly worried.
You know, as much as I'd LOVE to see Muppet Babies on television again, I have my worries about it. Not trying to disagree with you here, Drtooth, just making conversation.
I'm thinking that if we have Muppet Babies come back into syndication and no other Muppet television show, the Muppets will only be known as them baby selves, not as the rich, deep, puppet characters we all know and love. I just don't know how I'd feel about bringing back Muppet Babies... at least not until they have another Muppet show on too.
Well it just depends on your opinion of the Muppet Babies. I have a great opinion of them and wouldn't mind if they were the only things brought back, at least for awhile. In its own way I thought it was just as deep as the other Muppet projects (and deeper than some of the new ones). But that's obviously an opinion question.
This is the exact reason I never liked Muppet babies because when I would talk about the Muppets people would go "OOOOOOOH! You mean the Muppet Babies" and I then i want to call crazy harry to come blow them up haha
An aquaintence of mine once stated his distain for the "Muppets' high squeaky voices," of course mistaking them for the Muppet Babies. Sure, as a kid I enjoyed the first couple of seasons, but man...I really don't dig the lower production values. There's no excuse for sub-par animation like that in my opinion.
It was rumored that pre-Disney buy-out the Muppet Babies were to return through the same CG puppet animation technology as Henson is using with the Scrumps and Big Idea. Now that would be interesting - but there always should be a *real* Muppet project on the table. I feel the Babies, while cute and with potential of their own, reduce the Muppet Brand to kiddie fare.
I agree 100% I want Muppets of the ground before Disney even touches Muppet Babies.
See I just don't see the Muppet Babies as kiddie stuff. They were much more creative and deeper than a lot of cartoons around at the time (and even today). Dora is kiddie stuff, but the Muppet Babies were more than that.
And personally I don't care what other people think; like if they mistake the Muppets as kids' stuff. They are wrong. End of story. You can't please everybody and you shouldn't try. I'm not going to hide a perfectly good show away just because some people don't get it.
But again, everyone has the right to their opinon.
Yeah. I mean, I'd love to see them all. But I just hate the crop of Baby versions of characters. MB was great. Tiny Toons was the only other good one. I was fortunate to watch both TMS and MB when I was younger on Saturdays. I'm just saying to put them on Baby products, and not Baby Looney Tunes, baby Mickey, Baby pooh, Baby proncesses, baby whatever the heck is left.
I will say Sesame Beginnings has MB beat, because they actually found a way for it to be all Puppet. If they did that with MB the price would have been astronomical. I like what they were trying to do with Little Muppet Monsters, and have the Muppets actually host it. But that never came to pass.
I just am saying, for an educational kid's show MB was ahead of it's time... actually, not even that. it was in a class of itself. I think it was very beautifully done and broke ground we never broke before. Plus, it was the best thing Jeffery Scott ever did (Pacman is a disgrace. Don't looki it up on Youtube... you'll be sorry).
And look at today's horrendous fare. it's made soley for 2 year olds and slow witted youngsters.
But I do agree we should focus on the Muppets themselves before MB... but there isn't one of us here that has kids (I don't actually) that wouldn't watch the show with them or buy products. Plus, right now we're having the people who grew up with the show who have kids (once again, unlike me) that would share it with their chlidren.
I think we should find a way to put all the Muppet productions back on television. hey! Maybe PBS could do it. I mean, TMS was a Bristish show, technically. it would fit perfectly on their "Britcom" line up.
At first I read "AF" as "Alf". It's not often that people abbreviate "action figure".
Here's some things that I wish Disney would do:
First of all, I think that Disney should produce a Muppet TV special. Not a made-for-TV movie or mini-movie, but a special, like the various Mupet specials of the 1980s. Perhaps they could revive Kermit's Christmas Capers, or make a music special (similar to Elmopalooza), or maybe even focus on a holiday other than christmas (it's probably too late for a halloween or thanksgivign special to come out this year, unless there have alreayd been top-secret plans). Or maybe have the Muppets go on vacation.
Next, Disney should release more of it's existing Mupet productions on DVD and/ or one of it's television chanels. Show TMM, GMC, MTI, and MWoO more often. Broadcast reruns of TMS and MB. Have weekend reruns of Mupets Tonight, and maybe even the MupeTelevision segments of The Jim Henson Hour. Show the older specials every once in awhile. It's almost Jim Henson's birthday, maybe he Mupets Celebrate Jim Henson could be shown to celebrate (yes, I know that it was a tribute special).
A lot of Muppet productions are full of copyrited songs and characters. If Disney is concerned about song and character rights for a DVD release, then try to release some Muppet productions on DVD that don't have little-to-no songs or characters owned by other companies, like The Muppets at Walt Disney World (this should be a no-brainer), or Muppet Classic Theater, or the Play-Along Videos, or the Tales From Muppetland specials. It would be great if Disney would go as far as to release a Little Mupet Monsters boxed set.
I think that Disney should produce some Muppet comic books, or mangas, or graphic novels. And there should also be some new, interesting video games. It seems like there were a lot of Muppet video games prodcued between 2000 and 2003, but there should be some more. Maybe have some focus on one or two supporting characters (like Animal or Beaker). Make some game sbased on the movies. Maybe make a Mupet edition of Kingdom Hearts (though I've never played those games). Make sequels to Mupet Racemania and Muppet Party Cruise. Make a Pigs in Space game.
Wow! Just waht I was thinking. just because they have to start small, doesn't mean microscopic.
Rerun one of the Muppet films, even on syndication. They used to air MCC once and a while on syndication. That's all it takes.
A special? Sure. They don't even have to make anything else for a little while. Show one of the filmed, unsold pilots as a special (provided they fit in a half hour programing block).
And comics would be a smashing idea. Even if they have to make deals from Guy Gilchrist or Marvel, even reprint something in a graphic novel format. Something Manga sized would be great, but any standard larger scale one would be nice. Collect the comics from Muppet Magazine into a volume or something. It would work wonderfully.
See, they can even try to bring them back with minimal effort.
Maybe it would be good if Disney produced some Muppet short films, similare to the old Disney, Warner Bros., and MGM shorts from the 1930s, 1940s, and 1950s. I don't think there have been many puppet shorts in theaters, but they could probably last 5-10 minutes, and focus on a small number of characters (like the various Looney Tunes shorts, or even the various Muppet Show sketches).
Ooooooooooh! That would be the coolest! Great idea. They could start off all the new Disney movies. They had a new Pluto cartoon several years back at the head of some film, I forget which one though, but it was really neat seeing a Disney short on the big screen.
... problem is a lot of companies refuse to do that. And to see them you have to go to a horrible movie. I really wish they would bring back the premovie cartoon short. Rarely they will. When i saw George of the Jungle, it had that new Mickey Mouse cartoon.
But little mini movies like that would be a great idea. Highly improbable. Maybe if they do it instead of "welcome" to the theater. Sort of like the Loews ciniplex things they used to have with Sesame Street characters.
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