Why don't most people like "Muppet Treasure Island"?

[Salmoto]

What I always loved about the Muppets was that each and every one of them, with few exceptions, were performers. To paraphrase a line sung by Clifford, they each had a job to do, and they did it for you. Everyone had a varying level of talent, from Piggy's world class acting to Lew Zealand's spinning fish, but they were all entertainers at heart.

What bugs people about MTI was that the characters were somewhat removed from their roles as entertainers. Previous movies had them at least showing a little behind the scenes action, but in Treasure Island, they remained in character throught the entire film, the only exceptions being Gonzo and Rizzo, who played themselves.

I'm gonna get keelhauled for saying this, but even "Muppets From Space" had more to do about the Muppets being entertainers than MTI. In Space, Kermit says that he's currently on vacation from acting and was planning on relaxing if he didn't have to paint the boarding house, fix the oven and save Gonzo from a top secret military base. He got some free time to play cards with Pepe and Clifford, although he didn't seem to be at Gonzo's jacuzzi party. Piggy, who's never stopped being a ham in any movie to date, tries a new career at journalism while Gonzo gets the Electric Mayhem to substitute him at a bah mitzvah. Of course, this was all realitively minor compared to the rest of the film.

What is most out of character for the Muppets in the more recent films is that they don't send the message is that they're putting on a show anymore. That was the heart of the whole henson legacy: Kermit, Piggy, Fozzie and Gonzo represented 4 different aspects of showbusiness and they used their talent to both enrich their lives and the lives of the audience. I for one loved Kermit becuase unlike other lead characters, he was intentionally giving his all in order to make me, happy. Maybe not hust me, but at least me and the people sitting with me in the movie theatre.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

I don't see any keelhaulnig in your future...I kinda agree with ya.

FOZ

 

[Jessie]

Chilly

I agree with everything you said about MCC, but I have to agree with Jamie with

I just can't comprehend how you could put TGMC behind MFS,

:0)

 

[Chilly Down]

Jamie,

You make some excellent points about Caper. I certainly don't mean to imply that I hate the film at all. The movie has many great moments, including the bit at the beginning where they read the credits (Fozzie: "What does A.S.C. stand for?"), and Gonzo suggests that they try what they're doing without a balloon. Kermit: "Try what? Plummeting?" Gonzo: "Yeah!" I was just left with a feeling of wanting more in some way.

It's kind of funny, because Foz's comments about why he liked Caper -- that even though they kept their names, they were essentially playing characters -- is a large part of my problem with the movie, I think. In that way, MTI and Caper are kind of linked in my mind. I agree with most of what Sal had to say about MTI, and almost all of it can be applied to Caper as well for me. My love for Christmas Carol is the exception, not the rule.

Jamie and Jessie,

I know it may seem astonishing to put Space before Caper. But perhaps it's that I'm overly familiar with Caper too -- Space at least has the advantage of being new. Also, Caper just feels very dated in a late 70s/early 80s way to me. There are many strengths that Space has over Caper (including the camaderie between the core 4, missing from Space). But I guess what I'm saying is that if I had both DVDs sitting at home right now, I'd be far more likely to watch "Brickhouse" or Pepe in a tutu than Piggy's water ballet.

Finally, why does everyone pick on Piggy's 80s perm? For the time, it was very fashionable. I think Piggy's current 'do is much worse -- it's much too plain. But that's just another one of my strange Dissenting Muppet Opinions.

 

[frogboy4]

I feel that MFS is more dated than TGMC in that the Muppets were trying so hard to be current in Space while in Caper they gave a much less "forced" performance in my view. When Kermit said "Way to get down with your funky selves," at the end of Brick House, I must admit to sinking in my theater seat. I undersatnd how spme may think new is better, but I guess I just think Caper had that spark that was missing in Space and has been missing for a very long time with the Muppets - except when Pepe brightens up the screen. I stand by the classics I love while I look for new ones. I can understand wanting to watch MFS more than Caper - there's so much to see in the film, but that doesn't mean I feel it is better than Caper. I guess there's a different criteria for what makes a better film. Hmmm.

Piggys perm. It is terrible and I always found it tacky even when I was a kid - and I lived in Texas at the time, big hair central. LOL! I like her hair fine now, but nothing beats her classic long hair with the slight wave. I guess she's too old for that now, but something similar with more sophistication would be cool!

And what about Fozzies new psycopathic and abnormal behavior since TMTM? He was barely in TMCC, bizarre in MTI and a compulisve nosepicker/wallflower in MFS. Eeeek!

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Them yonder's fightin' words!!

"And what about Fozzies new psycopathic and abnormal behavior since TMTM? He was barely in TMCC, bizarre in MTI and a compulisve nosepicker/wallflower in MFS. Eeeek!"

Okay, so, again I agree with you; still, where's my rubber chicken? Head smackin' time again.

I think it's only due to Oz's abscence. We all know that MTI required him to be so...(insert word here)...crazy acting, and they didn't have many roles for him in MCC cause I don't think there's too many roles to disperse; but I agree that Muppets From Space SHOULD (and could) have had Fozzie doing bigger things, and better roles. I think the nose picking thing was an attempt for "shock value" as was Miss Piggy's running up the stairs, "Oh! I gotta PEE!"

Who's to blame? The writers. They could do a better job by studying scripts by Jerry Juhl. Plain and Simple.

I also agree with Chilly, Miss Piggy is much too glamorous for that plain hair do they give her. She's a DIVA! They should hire a professional hair-stylist (my MOM) to do it!! My mom loves the Pig and would do wonders for her. She cuts MY hair (heh heh--inside joke only for those who've seen my pics).

Anyhow, they SHOULD be getting more of Jim's old characters and Frank's old characters BACK in the limelight again with all the new voice performers they have.

And Skeeter? Who was it that mentioned Skeeter? NO! ABSOLUTELY NOT!! i won't have anything to do with Muppet Babies' spin-offs because that cartoon confused many of the 80's chilluns who grew up wondering who the Muppets really were when they saw something that wasn't animated. Ew. Like those Ninja Turtles. Who ever thought Donatello would be reduced to a TURTLE??

Grrrr...Oh, get ready Frogboy, here's my rubber chicken!!
FOZ
Wait! My rubber chicken!! It's...it's...*sigh*...something for another thread.

The other thread: See: "The Infamous Rubber Chicken" under General Discussions.

 

[frogboy4]

Ouch. A rubber-chicken lashing!

I have had the same thought about Skeeter and Muppet Babies, but I think a grown up Skeeter voiced by a seasoned Muppet performer could be a good thing. There aren't enough strong female characters in the Muppets and she could be one of them. My fear is that they'd give her more time than Scooter and that would be very wrong.

About Miss Piggy - didn't she used to have a stylist? I think she should have a more mature version of her long hair slightly curled in a modern fashion. Simple and elegant. They have made her look a lot fatter and older these days - time for a face lift IMHO!

 

[Fozzie Bear]

I hope you didn't mean OUR Miss Piggy, but rather the puppet. I still say that the new 'molded' puppets are kinda stiff. But, I hear Gonzo likes the molded puppets, and those with fugus and spores as well! WOCKA WOCKA!!

FOZ

 

[frogboy4]

Yeah, I keep noticing the Waldorf syndrome in all the materials I have gone through lately. Eeek. He does look like he was abducted.

 

[Beauregard]

Re: About Muppet Treasure Island

I do find it weak that they remade two classic tales rather than just making them Muppet movies

I don't think that it is weak. I think they should do some of the other clasics as well.

Imagine Pigy as Cinderella, Snow White, or a Little Mermaid!!!

Or Kirmet as Philios Frog

Also I love all the FIRST Muppet movies. TGMC, TMM, & TMTM