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What if Rowlf was the main Muppet?

Discussion in 'Classic Muppets' started by muppetfan89, Aug 14, 2008.

  1. ryhoyarbie

    ryhoyarbie Well-Known Member

    Personally I don't even know if Piggy really loves Kermit. I think she's just using him since he's in a high position.

    You know women. Same thing applies to pigs who have big egos.

    I wouldn't even think Rowlf would even have a thing for Piggy. He's too laid back to care about her.

    Piggy: Rowlfie, I need you.
    Rowlf: Go away! It's alone time with me and my piano. It was out of tune before I fixed it you know. We have a special bond.
    Piggy: And we don't?
    Rowlf: Our bond is about as special as a bond where you get gum stuck on your shoe.
    Piggy: Thanks a lot flee-bag!
  2. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    Miss.Piggy fell in love with Kermit before she knew who he was though...I know women, since I happen to be one , and just because we do or don't have a big ego has nothing to do with real love IMHO :p. Now greed, that's a different matter, but it always seemed as if Kermit was only making ends meet as far as money went, even when the show was doing very well...

    I can't see Rowlf saying something truly mean to Miss. Piggy as anything more than a joke though, even if they don't love each. He just isn't that hard hearted..he has a puppy dog soul :3
  3. AnimatedC9000

    AnimatedC9000 Well-Known Member

    I can't see him saying anything that mean to anybody. (Unless he was joking.) I think some of the Schroeder/Lucy moments of "Peanuts" pretty much sum their relationship up.

    For instance, this is probably what it would be like around Christmas...

    Rowlf: "This is the music I've selected for the Christmas play."
    [Rowlf plays Fur Elise]
    Piggy: "What kind of Christmas music is *that*?"
    Rowlf: "Beethoven Christmas music."
    Piggy: "What has Beethoven got to do with Christmas? Everyone talks about how "great" Beethoven was. Beethoven wasn't so great."
    [Rowlf stops playing]
    Rowlf: "What do you mean Beethoven wasn't so great?"
    Piggy: He never got his picture on the cover of a famous magazine, did he? Have you ever seen his picture on a fashion magazine, or even the tabloids? Hmmm? How can you say someone is great who's never had his picture on any well-deserving magazine?"
    Rowlf: "Good grief."

    And this:

    Piggy: "Say, by the way, can you play "Jingle Bells"?"
    [Rowlf proceeds to play "Jingle Bells", which sounds like a traditional grand piano]
    Piggy: [interrupting] "No, no. I mean "Jingle Bells." You know, deck them halls and all that stuff?"
    [Rowlf begins to play again, this time sounding like it's being played on an organ]
    Piggy: [interrupting again] "No, no! You don't get it at all. I mean "Jingle Bells." You know, Santa Claus and ho-ho-ho, and mistletoe and presents to pretty girls."
    [gazes lovingly at Rowlf, who then out of frustration taps one key of the piano while playing "Jingle Bells," which sounds like a child's toy piano]
    Piggy: "That's it!"
    [Rowlf turns a few unplanned flips from Piggy's reaction]
  4. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    Those skits were hilarious, no matter who did them.

    But as much as I support Lucy/Schroeder (Recall that--as much as they fight--Schroeder did come to realize that he had grown so used to Lucy being a certain way around him that she accidentally became his muse of sorts [I mean, he couldn't even play Beethoven without her]), I am firmly in the belief that something in Kermit alone makes him stand out to Miss Piggy. What that is, though, I have absolutely no idea!

    Note that in Muppet Family Christmas (which came out in 1987, after 1984's Muppets Take Manhattan), Scooter brings some home movies with him for the gang to share & in the home movies, the puppet versions of the Muppet Babies are seen, proving that--even if it was a dream in a previous film--Piggy probably would've loved Kermit even if they were in diapers together.

    Why? We don't really know. All that's known is that Piggy has some attraction to Kermit & it is that which drives her to stick it out, even when things are tough (i.e. whenever Piggy and Kermit are captured, Piggy often breaks free because her feelings for Kermit--and not wanting him to leave her [by death or other means]--are that strong).
  5. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    Hmm... I can't help but to wonder, if Piggy made fun of Beethoven, would Rowlf's bust of Beethoven have anything to say about it?
  6. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    Huh? The first appearance of Miss Piggy was in a scene where Kermit was in a sort of "position of power." He was the conductor for the Muppet Glee Club. Though, I don't think Miss Piggy's affection for Kermit is because of his power. Piggy has always been more about looks and charm, such as with Christopher Reeves.
  7. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    If the Muppet Babies are a part of the Muppet canon--Muppets Take Manhattan & Muppet Family Christmas--then Piggy's first appearance chronologically wise would be as a baby.
  8. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    I don't see Muppet Babies as canon, but I do think Kermit and Piggy met prior to the first episode of the Muppet Show. At least for what we see on camera. He had to have hired her previously.
  9. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    The Muppet movies aren't really "canon," but I see your point.

    Anyway, I don't think Rowlf would be in a relationship with Miss Piggy. I think they'd have pretty much the same relationship they have on The Muppet Show, jabbing at each other. Now, perhaps Rowlf might find himself going after another lovely lassie...?
  10. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    Considering how she knew him even before the first episode, that's a given.
  11. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    I like to think things happened a lot like they did in the first movie, it really is canon as far as being most of the only history we have to go on:p
  12. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    But Kermit did say that the movie was an approximent guess at how The Muppets met.
  13. Redsonga

    Redsonga Well-Known Member

    But other than that guess we really don't have anything else, so I would think that makes it canon :o
  14. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    What I question is whether or not the "wedding" was canon. XD
  15. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    That line is more Jim Henson saying, "What you're about to see is not real... but have fun with it anyway." I think, outside of The Muppet Show, it's anyone's guess what's canon. This is why "Muppet canon" is avoided on Muppet Wiki. For instance, Gonzo has recently been referred to as a "Weirdo" or a "Whatever," so he's not really considered an alien... but on the Muppets From Space commentary, which, since it's an interview, would seem to be be canon, Gonzo says he's an alien, and Muppets From Space is based on his discovery of that. His line removes the film itself from canon, but still claims that the events within the film are canon... confusing?
  16. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    Just as confusing as trying to understand multiple canon universes (like DC Comics' various franchises or the Sonic franchises).
  17. Baby Gonzo

    Baby Gonzo Well-Known Member

    I agree. Personally, I like to think of The Muppet Show to be a very natural setting which we get to see the backstage lives of the Muppets. Once you get down to it, (and I know someone out there is going to gut me for saying this), It's a Very Merry Muppet Christmas Movie and Muppets From Space, which are considered some of the Muppet's weakest movies, also feature this sort of behind the scenes/what the Muppets are doing when the camera isn't rolling sort of feel.

    Well, I hate to say it, (but some realist is bound to bring it up sooner or later) when you get right down to it, they are fictional characters and the writers can do whatever they want with them, canon or not.
  18. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    This is true. The same applies to any fictional being, no matter how beloved. Heck, Archie practically turned Sonic into a pimp, considering how he's been with every female within his comic book timeframe (though his longest-running relationship was the one with Sally).
  19. Super Scooter

    Super Scooter Well-Known Member

    Actually, I was thinking that. I just wasn't going to bring it up. :)

    I always thought of the Muppets as actors, taking on different roles, which is probably why I'm one of the few to really like the storybook movies. None of the movies follow the same timeline, really.

    Though, JHH frequently refers to TMS...

    Anyway, how does Rowlf fit into the canon?

    :sleep: :boo: : Push him in with a plunger! Do, ho ho ho!
  20. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh Well-Known Member

    But for me, TMM set the standard, so it is canon in my book, even if there is no real set canon.

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