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Tinseltown News

Discussion in 'Henson Alternative' started by Barry Lee, Aug 1, 2007.

  1. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    A Little Recap on Forum Rules (with link)


    Fans from around the world come together at Muppet Central to celebrate the work of Jim Henson. We encourage your active participation in discussions on our forum.

    Muppet Central is dedicated to the celebration of differences that make the world interesting and exciting. Healthy debates are not only expected but encouraged. Please remember to treat others with respect. Like the Muppets, each of us is unique, but our admiration and respect for Jim Henson's Muppets have brought us together and make us a family. Together, we have found that our similarities make us much more alike than different.

    By participating in this forum you agree to follow this code of conduct:


    Respect differences of opinion. It's fine to disagree, just remember that the other person has a right to their opinions and experiences too. Respect diversity. Don't attack someone else because of their beliefs or way of life. All ages from the young to the old are active in our forum. Please phrase your language and comments accordingly. Respect others. If you don't like a person's viewpoints say why without attacking the individual. Don't treat them in a way that you wouldn't like to be treated yourself.


    We are notorious for talking about penguins, muffins and whatnot without much reason. Short off-topic remarks are fine. If a thread seems to be changing topic, please create a new thread for the new subject. This helps folk find the information they are looking for quickly and easily.


    Any behavior that is not in the spirit of our guidelines may result in a warning. Subsequent behavior, depending on the nature, may result in suspension or ejection from the forum. Overly aggressive behavior and/or complete disregard for the spirit of these guidelines may result in immediate banishment. Action will be taken with the discretion of the staff. Please help keep Muppet Central a fun place for everyone.

    Link to view the complete forum rules.

    I listed three main guidelines. There are more. These rules were formed by all the moderators at the time and work well today - when followed.
  2. beaker

    beaker Well-Known Member

    Well, for legal reasons only Muppet Show, Bear in the Big Blue House and Sesame Street are considered "Muppets(TM)"...

    However, I think most people consider everything from PuppetUp to
    Fraggle Rock "Muppets"

    But no, Disney has no jurisdiction over this. Disney releases a number of R rated films through subsidiaries.

    As much as I hate Disney having the Muppets, Im glad JHC is able to
    focus on going into new Muppety directions as well as fantasy films.
  3. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    I know it's off-topic, but I think Disney is the company releasing Fraggle Rock! I've seen this on IMDB and other places on the web. I hope that's wrong. :smirk:

    You are right about the Muppet name ownership, of course, but it appears that it's been used in the lower-case form for Tinseltown in articles I have read. Hmmm. :confused:
  4. The Count

    The Count Moderator Staff Member

    Well... HIT Entertainment is the one releasing the Fraggle Rock season sets on DVD. If there are any further flare-ups Jamie, please tell us by who so we can take the appropriate actions.

    Maybe a new thread discussing Tinsel Town exclusively should be created, kind of like what was done with the Muppet Geography game?
  5. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    Thanks Count.

    Oh, correction - I meant the Fraggle Rock Movie will reportedly be released through Jim Henson Pictures and Walt Disney Pictures. Looks like they found their budget! :excited:

    Speaking of the Disney Company...I remember when Roger Rabbit came out. Many groups and critics found it far too racy to have anything to do with Disney. How times have changed. I suppose Henson is making an interesting experiment with Henson Alternative! :cool:

    I sure hope there is a new Tinseltown short tomorrow, even though it seems unlikely. I'm sure there's another 10 minutes edited. Once a project is shot, that stuff usually comes quickly. With modern non-linear/digital editing, many films are nearly cut-together before principle shooting wraps. :eek:
  6. MuppetQuilter

    MuppetQuilter Member

    I'm with Jamie on this one. Tinseltown is a JHC production. We may not be able to call them "Muppets" from a legal stand point but it certainly contains Muppety characters. Tinseltown belongs on this forum.

    I'm all for insisting on a certain level of respect and decency (obviously). I expect the religious comments in this thread to be a thing of the past as they have continually led to members feeling attacked and uncomfortable.

    I expect from here on out we can simply discuss Tinseltown.
  7. GelflingWaldo

    GelflingWaldo New Member

    Sorry to say but that's just a wild rumor that has sprung up on places like Wikipedia, Imdb and other sites due to ignorant people thinking Disney owns Henson. As of right now Disney is not part of the Fraggle Rock film (but who knows, could end up being a part of it). The script is still in development and no distributor or co-producer has been lined-up yet.
  8. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    Really? I was kind of on the fence about Disney involvement with the Fraggle Movie. I don't think the Disney Company can really understand what the Fraggles are all about. The IMDB seems to have been updated recently about Disney and Buena Vista. Hmmm.

    As for Disney suing Henson over the Muppety puppets of Tinseltown...well, that's an interesting point. It all depends on how the contract was inked for the Muppets between the two companies. Should we just call non-Disney Muppet projects - Huppets? LOL! Just thinking of all the Ebay misspellings of Muppet related items already. "Own this rare Sesame Street Fraggle Gonzo toy from John Hendersen's Muffets!"
  9. MuppetQuilter

    MuppetQuilter Member

    Disney won't sue JHC over Tinseltown. The lawyers will have made sure JHC can continue to do puppet productions and the lawyers will have checked out copyright issues before Tinseltown hit the air. Technically Disney may own the name "Muppets" but I believe SST can still call their Muppets Muppets. I think Disney owns the name "Jim Henson's Muppets." Sesame owns "Sesame Street Muppets" (I think) and I don't know the standing of plain old "Muppets."
  10. Convincing John

    Convincing John Well-Known Member

    OK, gotcha. I just wondered how it all fit together. The last thing I'd want is for a new Henson production to be grounded over some "gray area" of legal copywrites.

    And just to throw this into the mix, the opening credits of FR had "starring Jim Henson's Muppets" in it once upon a time. So Fraggles (at one time) were considered "Muppets", too.

    Finding out "who owns what" can be tricky sometimes. (Consider this question about Beautiful Day Monster). With legal issues, some areas bewteen Henson and Disney are sort of fuzzy. But then again, a lot of Muppets are fuzzy, so its appropriate. (lol);)

    Convincing John
  11. GelflingWaldo

    GelflingWaldo New Member

    Yeah some of the legal stuff is fuzzy. To give a clear-cut and complete list of who "owns" what is not really possible. Some things are simple to call, but others fall into somewhat of a grey area. Luckily Henson and Disney (and Sesame Workshop) are all on very friendly terms and will work things out on a case-by-case basis. The real issues come down to the intent behind the way things are represented and presented. I doubt there will be a law suit due to a use of some minor puppet or a similar design (maybe someone will get a phone call telling them to please knock it off and change something). But they all respect each other, work together constantly and are in communication almost daily about stuff (even in the planning stages of project to make sure things are kosher).
  12. MuppetQuilter

    MuppetQuilter Member

    Well, Sesame Workshop can't use Kermit as a roving reporter anymore because they can't afford the fees Disney charges for him. That doesn't seem super friendly to me-- charging a non-profit an arm and a leg for a character they used for years before you got a hold of him. I know SST hadn't used Kermit much in the years prior to Disney's purchase of the Muppets but that still irks me.

    Anyone want to put together a comparison of pig puppets through the years-- first season TMS, later MS, MT, Tinseltown.... There's been a lot of evolution. First season MS Piggy is kind of like an early sculpt of Palisades' first Muppet line. Pigs have come a long way.
  13. Fozzie Bear

    Fozzie Bear Well-Known Member

    I'd like to see some more of the characters, and hope they get a few other writers to add more humor to the show. There's something missing in the characters, but that's in every first show.

    I look forward to more opportunities to chance it out.

    I did like some of the little things, though--screaming for Arturio to get sunglasses, his nose through the glass before he comes out in the leather gear, and I like the typing-intros of the characters.
  14. anytimepally

    anytimepally Active Member

    on LOGO's website, they were called "Muppets" (with the captial M) earlier in the week, but it's since been changed to "puppets" :smirk:
  15. frogboy4

    frogboy4 Inactive Member

    I wonder if Disney's ownership of the Muppets will alter Kermit's appearance in Sesame's classic Follow That Bird future reissues?

    I think the Tinsel puppets are structured differently than classic Muppets. There is something that skews differently with the design that I just can't put my finger on. :confused:
  16. GelflingWaldo

    GelflingWaldo New Member

    True Disney is somewhat protective of Kermit as he is really the core icon of their brand - the Muppet. Just like Sesame and Henson are protective of the exposure and control of core properties. Although the companies get along, work together on projects and are fairly friendly, they all want to make sure that their individual brands and properties remain distinctive and they retain their own identity in the public eye. That’s one reason why Henson altered the title screens on the early Fraggle Rock DVDs to remove the word “Muppet” – not because Disney legally demanded them to, but because they wanted to distance themselves from “The Muppets”. And one of the reasons for Kermit’s exclusion of the Emmet Otter DVD had to do Disney wanting to ensure a separation of properties. So while that armadillo puppet may have be used on Disney owned “Bear in the Big Blue House” and the DVD extras of “Kermit’s Swamp Years”, it has been used on “The Animal Show” and “Puppet Up!” - no one is overly concerned about him, he’s not a core brand asset like Kermit. Disney wants Kermit (and those other core characters) to be associated with their productions and their brand, especially in these early years while distinguishing themselves from Henson and Sesame. Similarly Sesame and Henson are distinguishing their brands from the Disney owned stuff. No one is being mean here, it’s a mutual understanding of preserving all of the separate ownerships. They just want to make sure the public can distinguish between the owners and productions. Again, with the use and law behind intellectual properties, such as characters, more focus is on the intent behind it and public perception of it. As long as Henson doesn’t present their stuff as being associated with or endorsed by or a part of the now Disney owned “Muppet” brand they are pretty free from legal complications with the mouse. That’s why the word Muppet and even phrases like “from the creators of the Muppets” and such aren’t used. But bah-humbug to all this law talk, it’s complicated and there’s really nothing that our yammering will change about it. Things are what things are - Henson, Disney and Sesame all seem to be okay with the positions they are in. And Kermie may not be reappearing on Sesame Street much anymore (which isn't totally a Disney thing, it started after Jim passed away but was really driven home when Henson sold Sesame off), at least many of those classic gems Jim produced are seeing the light of day in the Old School sets.

    But back to Tinseltown...that is what this threads about, right... if you look on AlienBootCamp.com right now, you’ll see Tinseltown is the highest rated video on the entire site! Hooray for being #1 (with an impressive 5-star average rating). Hopefully that sends a positive message to Logo and Henson... although it couldn't hurt to take a few seconds to drop them an email of thanks and support as well. I can't wait for more!
  17. GelflingWaldo

    GelflingWaldo New Member

    The do have a differnt feel. They are fairly large - I mean, Bobby is much bigger than the average Muppet. Plus they have pretty expressive eye mechanisms.

    The characters were designed by Gene Barretta (Bill's brother). Gene also designed the characters for the "Late Night Buffet with Augie and Del" pilot.
  18. GelflingWaldo

    GelflingWaldo New Member

  19. wwfpooh

    wwfpooh New Member

    That line by Kermit is showing the professional relationship he and Piggy have...he's a professional and she thinks--nay, knows--they have something special in the relationship they share.
  20. TheJimHensonHour

    TheJimHensonHour Active Member

    Wow you people really are getting so bent out of shape over a show.
    The things that bother people these days with everything else going on in the world astounds me.

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